Windows Weekly 484: Microsoft for Life!

It's time for Windows weekly with

Paul Thurrott and Mary-Jo Foley.

Microsoft wants you for life,

and their ready to kill the next screen.

Paul is excited for the new Xbox and

Mary-Jo talks about Microsoft's

bad cloud day. Window's Weekly is next.

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This is Window's Weekly with Paul Thurrott

and Mary-Jo Foley. Episode 484, recorded

September 21, 2016 Microsoft for life!

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It's time for Windows weekly with
Paul Thurrott and Mary-Jo Foley.

I'm Father Robert Ballecer in for Leo Laporte

who is currently looking for the answers

to life, the universe and everything

acrossed the pond. Of course Paul Thurrott

is the guru behind Thurrott.com the

previewer of news, reviews and analyzes

for tech enthusiasts. Mary-Jo Foley the

mastermind behind ZDnet All About

Microsoft blog. Together their here to

bring a light to the deep cave of

Microsoft news, like a over charged light

bulb battery exploding in the darkness.

Paul, Mary-Jo so good to have ya.

(Mary-Jo laughs)

(Paul) It's like your introducing

Bond villains there.

(Mary-Jo) I know I was like Wow!

The masterminds.

(Paul) Master of Disaster Mary-Jo Foley.

(Father Ballecer) Do you have a cat?

and can you do this with your fingers?

- I think I need that on a business card.

If I still used business cards I would.

That is one of those strange things.

At these conventions that we go to these shows

we all do the business card thing and

I've even got down the whole Asian thing

of handing like this and a bit of a bow.

But, um, those collect dust afterwards,

I almost never use them.

- No, No! I don't even have one.

- I was going to say I think I have some,

but I've never brought them anywhere.

-Wait!, You two go to shows, don't you?

It's kind of a thing, it's how you say hello, right?

- uh

-Well now people just say, "where can

I find you?" and I just day "All About

Microsoft"

- Mary-Jo and I just bump our phones

together and say "Power twins activate."

(Mary-Jo laughs)

- No, I don't know every once in a while

someone will hand me a business cards

and I have a momentary bit of confusion,

like I don't have one of these things,

or I don't have it with me.

You know I feel, it's like a weird moment.

I feel like I need to give them something

in return, it's like someone comes over

with a gift and you don't have anything

to give them.

-Yeah, that's what it is. I know I'm handing

out cards like they are candy, but it's

just because I want to give you something.

It's like thank you very much for your time,

uh, here's something, and stop talking

to me now.

(laughing) yes, right!

(Paul) I've met the social obligation

(Father Ballencer) And if you actually want to see

where this is gonna be put up you can contact

ma at this other wise I'm just gonna assume

that you just don't care (Mary-Jo) Yep (laughter)

(Paul) I needed a resume for something,

you know, like a year ago or more, I. . .

Thurrott.com, what do you mean I...?

(laughing) I don't keep track of my

accomplishments, I'm not even sure what

I would do with that.

(Father Ballencer) Our Field producer,

Colene Goldstein, she's actually

really good LinkedIn. Before she hands over

her card, she'll just say can I find you on

LinkedIn and she's just building up this huge

network of all these people that she's connected

to and she says that's far more efficient

than trying to take a card and then remember

where it came from and who they

represented six weeks ago.

Because remember a lot of the people that

you meet don't actually work for that company

they work for a PR company that represents

the company that you are talking to. (Paul) Right.

and you won't remember who that is unless

you actually write it on the back of that card

and even then sometimes you don't remember

- I have to look at the lower third to remember

Mary-jo's name. (laughing) you know I'm

really not good at that kind of thing.

(Mary-Jo) He's bad at this thing.

(Father Ballencer) I have to look down here with her

If I don't see that?

(Paul) Hi! I'm Fr. Rob, What does that say?

(laughing) Sir Foley, ur no let's not do that.

I'll right let's get away from social convention

cuz we've got some pretty spectacular windows news

who's got this first one, because eventually

Microsoft has finally "oh! that's right we're not

offering the free version anymore, maybe we

should kill that nag screen"

Mary-Jo - Yeah I can start it off a bit. Um,

Yesterday, the 20th, Microsoft put out a

KB article that said "Hey we're finally going to

push through Windows update, an update

that takes away the Windows, get Windows10 app.

So if you remember July 29th was the actual day

the offer to get a free Windows 10 ended.

And at that time they said it might take us

a little while to faze this out because we've

so thoroughly inundated everyone with this app

and the promotion. So actually the real

day when this ended at least when the app ended

was yesterday. And it's starting to roll

through the Windows update. It replaces

the get Windows 10 app and it goes away.

But the weird complication not complication

but the weird kind of coincidence is

you can actually still get Windows 10 as free upgrade

You just have to use your existing Windows 7

or 8.1 product key and you can still unlock the free

upgrade, which is something Microsoft is not

actively advertising, but Paul has been verifying it daily.

(Paul) well weekly

(Mary-Jo) I've been asking him is it still up

(Fa. Bellencer) Cuz, I was told that if you do

the get Windows 10 thing and then you roll it

back you're always set you can always re-download it

(Paul) Oh! yeah, yeah this is for new installs.

In other words you have never done this before

you have a key you can do a clean Windows 10

right now and it would still work.

(Fa. Bellencer) Wait! What? That's not how

it's suppose to work.

(Mary-jo) Yep (Paul) I know, and by the way

one day it won't, I mean maybe this weekend

or the weekend after that, someday, I'm gonna

wake up, I'm gonna test it and it's not gonna work

you know it's just.. It's going to happen eventually.

But, um, I wrote an article about this

not working probably a month ago in anticipation

of it not working and it's just kept working

the things been sitting here at my desktop since

August. (Fa Ballencer) So you just try and

do an update everyday just to make sure it still goes?

(Paul) not everyday and least once a week.

- Now does this

(Mary-Jo) Yesterday, I said to him can you

still do it? And he's like, Yep you can!

-So does this now increase the value of the

Windows 10 upgrade, because now you can't get

it except maybe if you know this super secret,

now do people actually want it?

(Paul) I.. No.. I suppose.. I think the issue

is.. Well if you wanted to save some money

I suppose you could go buy Windows 8.1

product key and you know, well you

wouldn't actually buy Windows 8.1

I should say, it's possibly you can buy a copy of it

somewhere cheaper because nobody wants it

anymore and than you could upgrade now for less money

than buying Windows 10. Or maybe you just

had keys for some reason, maybe a company that has

keys allotted or you bought the package version

at some point, maybe you bought the Windows 7

family pack back in the day and you only used

two of the three keys and you've got an extra

one sitting around for what ever reason.

If you have a key it will work. If you

got them from TechNet that will work.

um, and someday it won't. So, we'll see.

-Microsoft won't say when they think

it will no longer work in fact they aren't

really publicly saying that it still works

if you ask them, they just don't answer

when you ask about this.

And I assume it's the same thing that they said

about the get Window 10 app

that it might take some time for them

to shut it off. But the other theory is they

are just leaving it open for those laggers

who didn't get around to updating by July 29th

and they can say to them "You know what, psst

by the way."

- It doesn't hurt anybody, I think that's the

point that if they are people out there in the world

with Windows 7 install that they've never done

Microsoft would much rather see them be on

Windows 10, if they're going to do a new Windows

install. Why wouldn't they want that.

- I can also see this heading off a lot of

complaints from people who said "oh man

I tried to upgrade and I totally forgot and I

did it in August and it didn't work anymore"

No that's not actually a valid excuse.

You know September 21st, October 21st,

It's starting to get to the point where

you can't pretend you've been

procrastinating and than just forgot I mean,

You know at some point it's just. . .

Their just leaving it open, its fine.

I have no problem with this.

- This is actually a huge opportunity for us

because I know Alex has been trying to

update the Tri caster to Windows 10

(Paul) Actually Padre, Let me correct you

you shouldn't run Windows update on the

Tri caster, New Tech doesn't say you should

So I really hope that nothing. . .

Oh Crap! (Laughing)

- This is what happens, You get a nag screen

in the middle of Windows weekly

that's oddly blocking me out entirely,

that's different (Mary-Jo) It is

You know we're going to have to live with this

for the next 20 -30 minutes because

unfortunately, click the initiated and it'll

take that much time to install and

uninstall it. (Mary-Jo) They'll see us though

we're off to the sides. Not when you zoom

on us, but the big picture you can see us.

(Paul) How do I know that this graphic hasn't

been used more gleefully on Macbreak weekly

and whatever morning show I'm sure you do?

(Fa Ballencer) Uh, this weeks it's Google,

I think this is actually the new title card

for Floss Weekly. Um Floss Weekly will

never reserve your copy.

Do either of you still have Windows 7, 8 & 10

Machines in your environment?

(Mary-Jo) Yes, I have 7,

(Fa Ballencer) So no 10 at all?

(Mary-Jo) Yeah I have 10 and 7, but no 8

(Fa Ballencer) Really? I have 7, 8.1 and 10

(Mary-Jo) You have all of them.

(Fa Ballencer) Well because I mean 10

does still kill some of my USB devices

so my production machines have to stay 8

and I have one laptop and that just works

better at seven.

(Mary-Jo) I just have the desktop I still

use because it's just an older machine,

the Dell that I've had for awhile I just left

it on 7, cuz I'm like Eh, when I need to

replace the machine Ill just get

Windows 10 machine.

(Paul) But what about all those gotta have it

apps you can't run?

-Um?!

(Fa Ballencer) Now a quick question,

this really did hurt Microsoft's reputation,

right? I mean Yes, That number of how

many deployments they have of Windows 10

is forever going to be asterisk.

People said "Well how many of those were

accidental upgrades or how many of those

were installs and then rollbacks almost

immediately. This. . Will people forget this

or will Windows 10 upgrade nag screen

be the butt of jokes for the next two

decades. (Paul) Honestly I think they've

irreparably harmed their reputation with

this and not just Microsoft generally but

the reputation of Windows as well.

The forced upgrade thing was a huge mistake

on their part and a very risky gamble and

the recent people aren't going to forget

it is because they came out and said we're

going to hit a billion within two to three

years and then right before Windows the

windows ten free upgrade ended they said

you know what we're not going to make that

goal and so even though they did that they

were unable to you know meet this reasonable

goal, I thought, of reaching a billion

users in that timeframe.

- You know Mary Jo there's two ways to

look at this. There's one way and this would,

I think this is where Paul lines up, there

was an executive or some marketing person

who said you know what we want to hit a

billion because it sounds like a great number.

So let's just force this on people. The

other way to think of this is that some

engineers said you know what people

will like ten if they just try it if we just

get it on the machine they will understand

what all the hoopla is about.

Which of those do you fall with?

- So I also, like Paul, think this was a

big mistake and the part that really

kind of riled me the most was when

Microsoft was taking the tack of saying

it's for users own good that were doing

this and you know I was like wait this is

so paternalistic How can you say what's

for my good or my mother's good who

accidently got Windows ten and like flipped

out when she got it you know I just think

that argument didn't work. I'm happy. They

made a free upgrade available very easily

to people but I don't think they should

have rammed it down people's throat.