"The hole in the wall: self organising systems" (with Twitter track) Sugata Mitra at ALT-C 2010

"The hole in the wall: self organising systems in education" Keynote speech by Sugata Mitra, Professor of Educational Technology at Newcastle University (Twitter track by agreement with Sugata) at "Into something rich and strange" - making sense of the sea change, the 2010 conference of the Association for Learning Technology (ALT). Session given in Nottingham, UK, on Wednesday 8 September 2010, at 14.00. For information about ALT go to http://www.alt.ac.uk/. Made publicly available by ALT under a Creative Commons Attribution-Non-Commercial 2.0 UK: England & Wales license http://creativecommons.org/licenses/bync/2.0/uk/.

Subtitle content provided by Twitter (Compiled by iTitle)

timbuckteeth: @sugatam now up and speaking on 'the future of learning' in the main auditorium - standing room only #altc2010 [13:06GMT]

Roxy_Sham: EMCC auditorium @UniofNottingham totally full for the first time during conf -#altc2010 'The hole in the wall' Sugata Mitra @Sugatam [13:06GMT]

nixsight: @timbuckteeth Obv! Education is full of love! #ALTC2010 [13:07GMT]

dajbconf: 750 million young people with 'inadequate resources', whilst 200m have 'adequate' & 50m have 'ample' #altc2010 @Sugatam [13:07GMT]

sarahhorrigan: '1 billion children on the planet - only 50 million with ample resources, 200 million with adequate... 750 million inadequate' #altc2010 [13:07GMT]

ScottHibberson: #altc2010 Sugata Mitra keynote http://twitpic.com/2memf6 [13:07GMT]

AJCann: #Altc2010 Daily - http://paper.li/tag/Altc2010 [13:08GMT]

patlockley: @kirstie_C chess isn't ethical - it's black v White. I think that's a Malcolm x quote #altc2010 [13:08GMT]

sarahhorrigan: immediacy of knowledge discovery and general complacency of youth? #altc2010 [13:08GMT]

dajbconf: . @Sugatam citing funny questions from children like "Why be a professor when I can earn as much as you driving a bus?" #altc2010 [13:09GMT]

dajbconf: Problems of relevant and aspiration at top of pyramid (ample resources) & problem of resources at bottom. #altc2010 [13:09GMT]

mattlingard: Wondering if Sugata Mitra did what he did at #mootuk10 Arrived by train from newcastle 2mins before he was due on stage Very cool #altc2010 [13:09GMT]

dajbconf: There are places in every country where 'good' teachers won't go. Global problem. Those places are where they're needed most. #altc2010 [13:10GMT]

gillferrell: #altc2010 Encouraged speaker is talking about possible futures rather than 'the' future [13:10GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugamata: There are places on Earth where good schools cannot be built and good teachers will not go. #altc2010 [13:10GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'places where good teachers won't go are where they are needed most - universal problem' - #altc2010 [13:10GMT]

johnmclear: What I don't get is how come so many US .edu's have adopted Etherpad/Primarypad yet no .ac.uk's have? #altc2010 #scaredofchange? [13:10GMT]

HughDavis: The places where good teachers will not go are just the places they are most needed. #altc2010 [13:10GMT]

pat3460: The places where the good places won't go are exactly the places where they are really needed #altc2010 [13:11GMT]

Emmadw: Sugata is just about to start - #altc2010 - read his work not long after I'd got back from PNG - where some kids loved experimenting on PC [13:11GMT]

dajbconf: . @Sugatam Test scores & distance from Delhi plotted on graph by @Sugatam. Startling decline. #altc2010 [13:11GMT]

dajbconf: In England? Density of council housing vs. GCSE results. More council housing = worse results. #altc2010 [13:12GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'density of council housing correlates with GCSE results - more housing, worse results' - #altc2010 [13:12GMT]

ravisandhu8: Sugata's talk #altc2010 showing so many similarities between the UK and others countries [13:12GMT]

vahva: Inspired by Sugata Mitra's work? This is what I think the implications might be for adult learning: http://trunc.it/ayuo9 #altc2010 [13:12GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 Higher % of council housing = lower GCSE resuls. [13:12GMT]

ashleyhwright: Interesting correlation between council housing and GCSE results #altc2010 [13:12GMT]

sarahhorrigan: remoteness in UK is not geographic, it's socio-economics - #altc2010 [13:12GMT]

bluplatypus: Interesting point : socioeconomic remoteness #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

traceymadden: Looking at coorelation between density of uk social housing and gsce scores #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

dajbconf: Remoteness in India = geographic, remoteness in England = socio-economic. #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

francescademo: Sugata Mitra @Sugatam keynote at #altc2010 sounding promising. Join via #Elluminate http://ow.ly/2B2nw [13:13GMT]

bensteeples: No computer teacher is going to go and teach in the slums in Delhi. #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'The hole in the wall' - computer put into hole in wall like an ATM - children taught themselves (in Indian slums / desert etc) #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Talking about placing computers in the slums of India. Children were teaching themselves in a short time #altc2010 [13:13GMT]

dajbconf: . @Sugatam now talking about 'Hole in the Wall' project (1999-2001) #altc2010 [13:14GMT]

AJCann: If you're not going to #altc2010 in person, there are still lots of ways you can participate online: http://bit.ly/aFLNF9 [13:14GMT]

dajbconf: Wonder if @HallyMk1 has any postcolonialism comments about @Sugatam's presentation? #altc2010 [13:15GMT]

traceymadden: Seeing children in India participate in the hole in the wall project #altc2010 [13:15GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: What happens to a group of children when you leave a computer with them: They teach themselves #altc2010 [13:15GMT]

sarahhorrigan: who needs IT teachers? #altc2010 [13:15GMT]

nixsight: Sugata Mitra's hole in the wall has correlation with story of library in US whose local homeless osmotically became web support. #ALTC2010 [13:15GMT]

ravisandhu8: Fascinating experiment in Asia and Africa where rural children learnt independently, by having a computer left with them #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

HughDavis: #altc2010 SO the claim is that we don;t need to teach digital literacy? [13:16GMT]

Emmadw: Great to hear about the Hole in the wall, having read it in the past. Good e.g. of need for good interfaces #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

dajbconf: @timbuckteeth Yes, but what counts as 'computer literacy'? #surfacelearning #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 children in slums teaching themselves 2 use a computer, after 6 months they have same computer literacy as an avg office secretary [13:16GMT]

Eingang: The Sugata Mitra Hole in the Wall computer at #altc2010 reminds me a lot of the oil drum rugged computer I saw recently. Will try to find. [13:16GMT]

lucyrstone: Computer literacy does not need a specialist teacher, children same standard as secretary after nine months of self teaching #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Despite language, culture, location, socio-economic status, the same result: children teach themselves with computer #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

AJCann: @dajbconf #surfacelearning Yes but #gottastartsomewhere #altc2010 [13:16GMT]

dajbconf: Hyderabad Experiment (2002) - improvements in English, Science & Mathematics scores. #altc2010 [13:17GMT]

dajbconf: @AJCann Yes, but defining what you mean is important! #surfacelearning #gottastartsomewhere #altc2010 [13:17GMT]

timbuckteeth: @dajbconf Wait to hear the rest of the story, the learning gets deeper :-) #altc2010 [13:17GMT]

dajbconf: @AJCann *Takes off overly-critical thesis hat* #altc2010 [13:18GMT]

balbirbarn: would be interested in discussion on the ethical considerations of the Hole in the Wall experiments? #altc2010 - it never gets covered! [13:18GMT]

traceymadden: Children using computrs to 'play' demonstrate improvements in other subjects #altc2010 [13:18GMT]

mweller: The hole in the wall project sounds similar to the container project http://www.container-project.net/ #altc2010 [13:19GMT]

sarahhorrigan: English skills are good - but learned with heavy accent due to lack of teachers in poor areas with ongoing career consequences #altc2010 [13:19GMT]

jsecker: Computer literacy doesn't need to be taught as children will learn in 9 months #altc2010 [13:19GMT]

dajbconf: Speech-to-text has to understand you, therefore trained in neutral English accent. Blocked out training & gave to Indian children. #altc2010 [13:19GMT]

sarahhorrigan: @JonPowles Don't. Mention. The. Lecture! It's this year's VLE!!! #altc2010 [13:19GMT]

mickelous: Saw @sugatam at #mootuk10. Still fascinating at #altc2010 [13:20GMT]

sverjans: Speech recognition software in The Hole in the wall project. Wondering whether it was Lernout&Hauspie software. #altc2010 #previouslives [13:21GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'children will achieve educational objectives on their own if they have a reason to' - #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Children learning to improve their English speaking accents through speech to text software #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

JonPowles: @sarahhorrigan I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

dajbconf: Indian children have a reason to learn & even invent pedagogies. Western children don't! #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

lucyrstone: Children will achieve educational objectives if they have a "reason" to #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

traceymadden: Use of speech to text softwear to help teachenglish pronunciation #altc2010 [13:21GMT]

bluplatypus: It's all about the motivation. Stupid #ALTC2010 [13:21GMT]

sarahhorrigan: @JonPowles *sharp intake of breath* ;o) #altc2010 [13:22GMT]

nixsight: That these kids managed to find useful tools online without access to peer support is brill. HARD to find stuff on living web. #ALTC2010 [13:22GMT]

dajbconf: Arthur C Clarke: "If children are interested, education happens." <--quoted by @Sugatam at #altc2010 [13:22GMT]

gillferrell: #altc2010 A teacher that can be replaced by a machine should be [13:22GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 children improving spoken english by d\l films and spoken dictionaries, then discussing in groups. They weren't told to do this!!! [13:22GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'when you have interest, you have education' - Arthur C. Clarke, 2004 - @sugatam Keynote #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

dajbconf: Someone by @Sugatam a Mac. Windows Moviemaker #fail #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

nixsight: Oh my god. Arthur C Clarke used exactly the same phrase I've been using on reluctant academics for 8 years. I'm all excited! #ALTC2010 [13:23GMT]

JonPowles: @dajbconf Not exactly: as he said at start, the issues are relevance and aspiration, not resources. Diff strategies needed #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

aidej: "a teacher who can be replaced by a machine...should be!" - Arthur C Clarke...Great quote! #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

jsecker: If children are interested then they will learn. Arthur C Clarke #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

sukik: finding Sumtra's talk refreshing; the need, motivation #altc2010 [13:23GMT]

ahiggi: wondering if "those places" need the 'good teachers' or just 'good teaching' role for ICT in improving teaching, not just learning#altc2010 [13:23GMT]

dajbconf: Seminal moment: Indian slum children find Google. Copy-and-paste FTW! #altc2010 [13:24GMT]

ashleyhwright: All students are savvy re: google #altc2010 [13:24GMT]

jak82: @traceymadden #altc2010 Yep we use dragon and iphones so they can practice when they want [13:24GMT]

jak82: @sarahhorrigan Need is more necessary #altc2010 [13:24GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Arthur C Clarke quoted saying 'Any teacher who can be replaced by a machine - should be' #altc2010 [13:24GMT]

JonPowles: Am loving the reality of the viral nature of children's self-directed learning. In general, teachers overestimate their role #altc2010 [13:25GMT]

dajbconf: LOL! @Sugatam bought himself an overcoat in 2006 having to go to Newcastle #altc2010 [13:25GMT]

MSJACOB: #altc2010 Sugata Mitra quotes Arthur C. Clarke a teacher than can be replaced by a machine, should be. [13:25GMT]

authenticdasein: some new stuff from Mitra, about his move to Newcastle. He's engaging as ever #altc2010 [13:25GMT]

dajbconf: Experiment 2006-2010 aiming to show that there are some things children can't teach themselves. #altc2010 [13:26GMT]

francesbell: In 2006 Sugata Mitra bought overcoat to move to Newcastle to do research #altc2010 [13:26GMT]

sarahhorrigan: what can children not teach themselves though? @sugatam keynote #altc2010 [13:26GMT]

heloukee: Sugata Mitra - Beyond Hole in the Wall - 2006-2010 (last saw this in 2008, great to follow progress) #altc2010 [13:26GMT]

ahiggi: @timbuckteeth but how long do those secretaries take to learn those skills? time can be as isolating as poverty #altc2010 [13:27GMT]

dajbconf: Kalikuppam Experiment (2007) - lots of orphans after natural disaster. Learn biotechnology of DNA replication? Surely not! #altc2010 [13:27GMT]

nixsight: This is one of those stories where the narrator tells you how it's going to turn out in their delivery. LOVE IT. #ALTC2010 [13:27GMT]

ashleyhwright: #altc2010 - It's not always raining in Ncl [13:28GMT]

dajbconf: Just goes to show that learning pretty much anything = immersion. #altc2010 [13:28GMT]

authenticdasein: the kuppam xperimnt 2007 - can children teach themselves high level science? The answer of course: yes.... #altc2010 BUT.. [13:28GMT]

sarahhorrigan: @vahva do teachers teach self esteem though? #altc2010 [13:28GMT]

lucyrstone: Inspirational sitting here contemplating the way I teach anyone else? #altc2010 [13:29GMT]

Emmadw: Fascinating to see the kids getting to grips with DNA information on the Hole in the Wall; #altc2010 [13:29GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Childen left to themselves can set bars a lot higher for themselves than teacher would set #altc2010 [13:29GMT]

dajbconf: Children set much higher bars for their own learning than we do! #altc2010 <--Massive pre- and post-test difference. [13:29GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 0% pre-test to 30% in two months - Tamil children teaching themselves biotechnology! #altc2010 [13:30GMT]

ALT: Questions for invited speaker @Sugatam welcomed via Twitter (#altc2010) & Elluminate (http://ow.ly/2B2zH) [13:30GMT]

sharonlflynn: Children set (learning) bars for themselves much higher than we can set for them. @sugatam keynote #altc2010 [13:30GMT]

sarahhorrigan: 'method of the grandmother - stand behind the children when they're working, and admire them' #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

nixsight: Important point from @sugatam about relative metrics for success/failure that can be applied to MOST people/situations. #ALTC2010 #Life [13:31GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 Give a child a PC, and they'll learn complex biotechnology knowledge in a very short time! [13:31GMT]

dajbconf: The 'Grandmother method' - stand behind children and "admire them" - give positive feedback. #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

lucyrstone: Method of the grandmother - stand behind the children and admire them #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

vahva: Question for @sugatam at #altc2010 'what implications does his work have for adult learning?' - from Bryony [13:31GMT]

sarahhorrigan: with method of the grandmother - results up to 50% - comparable with results at private school #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

andrewmid: #altc2010 just because you are asking questions doesn't mean you are assessing [13:31GMT]

JonPowles: In what arbitrarily innumerate world does "30% is a fail" have any real meaning in this context? I love this guy #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

dajbconf: Experiments in Gateshead (2009) - "remotest place I'd ever been". LOL! #altc2010 [13:31GMT]

VickiMcGarvey: #altc2010 grandmother = constructivist teacher [13:32GMT]

jsecker: Using the grandmother method of teaching encourages children to learn even more #altc2010 [13:32GMT]

authenticdasein: The gateshead experiments 2009: will those amazing results be replicated in UK? Can he make those children teach themselves? #altc2010 [13:32GMT]

sarahhorrigan: magic number is '4 children around one screen' for autonomous learning #altc2010 [13:32GMT]

AJCann: Question for @sugatam at #altc2010 'what implications does his work have for adult learning?' - good question, are adults as plastic as kids [13:32GMT]

vahva: I think tutors and trainers of adults are more like @sugatam's 'grandmothers' than a traditional 'teacher': http://is.gd/f0OeX #altc2010 [13:33GMT]

Emmadw: YouTube of Sugata's Kuppam experiment: http://youtu.be/lPlzVItHlP8 #altc2010 [13:33GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 "the children said 'you mean cheating?', I said 'yes' ... 'it happens in research all the time'" Classic :D [13:33GMT]

gillferrell: #altc2010 Where was he when I went to school in gateshead? [13:33GMT]

lucyrstone: 10 year olds encountering GCSE questions through group work, one computer per four children #altc2010 [13:33GMT]

dajbconf: Gateshead experiment - biggest challenge was to get the teacher out of the classroom. 9 year-olds doing GCSE questions. #altc2010 [13:33GMT]

JonPowles: "My hardest problem was getting the teacher out of the classroom" LOL! #altc2010 [13:34GMT]

jak82: @AJCann #altc2010 if there is a need we will learn, maybe not as quick though ... [13:34GMT]

sarahhorrigan: is being able to answers questions 'learning'? #altc2010 [13:34GMT]

dajbconf: "Is it learning?" Same 6 questions given in exam format two months later: 76% both times! #altc2010 [13:34GMT]

AJCann: @jak82 I'm less convinced about adult learning. #altc2010 [13:34GMT]

enm181: “@AJCann: If you're not going to #altc2010 in person, there are still lots of ways you can participate online: http://bit.ly/aFLNF9” [13:35GMT]

egrommet: @jonhickman @paulbradshaw have either of you been following #altc2010 - worth a look. elearning stuff [13:35GMT]

lucyrstone: Children had retained the information after two months, photographic recall #altc2010 [13:35GMT]

cathfenn: from the School of: Once you've heard a lecture you spend the rest of your life forgetting it! #altc2010 [13:36GMT]

dajbconf: British grandmothers teamed up with children in India via Skype. Win/win. Wonderful! #altc2010 [13:37GMT]

andyjb: we love our grannies @sugatams #altc2010 [13:37GMT]

Emmadw: Now he's getting British Grandmothers to work with Indian Kids! Excellent #altc2010 [13:37GMT]

AJCann: University of Granny. Yes we can #altc2010 [13:37GMT]

FieryRed1: #altc2010 I love the enthusiasm with which Sugata's research is conducted [13:37GMT]

aidej: Oh how true: "Once you've heard a lecture you spend the rest of your life forgetting it!" #altc2010 [13:37GMT]

JonPowles: British grandmothers teaching children online in India. "After many years, my house I'd filled with children's voices" #altc2010 [13:38GMT]

tim_vincent: #altc2010 City Uni London moved to Moodle in '09. ~60 staff working on project. Wowsers! [13:38GMT]

balbirbarn: @sugatam talk keeps referring to tests that the children did that demonstrated learning - would be good to see a sample #altc2010 [13:38GMT]

sarahhorrigan: role of equipment and layout also important to foster autonomy in learning #altc2010 [13:39GMT]

lucyrstone: I love the idea of Grandmothers Skyping children in India, amazing #altc2010 [13:39GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 Sugata showing that inclusive learning strategies can be used in many contexts, inter-generational too... [13:39GMT]

authenticdasein: "These two boys wanted to be footballers, after [watching] 10 TED talks, he wants to be Leonardo da Vinci" :-) #altc2010 [13:39GMT]

squinsee: Sugata Mitra's keynote shows how much we underestimate kids and try to control them . they can do so much if we let them go #altc2010 [13:39GMT]

tim_vincent: #altc2010 Gateshead school kid wanted to be footballer. 8 TED talks later and he wants to be Leonardo De Vinci. [13:40GMT]

lucyrstone: I would recruit my own mother as a Granny to support learning with children in India, if only she could use a computer #altc2010 [13:40GMT]

dajbconf: @squinsee Absolutely. And I'm a big fan, but they're replicating existing knowledge & it's not contextual. #altc2010 [13:40GMT]

jak82: So for higher education where the lecturers are subject experts and not 'Doctors'.. is this more important for us? #altc2010 [13:40GMT]

AJCann: @lucyrstone Well if he's right, she can teach herself #altc2010 [13:40GMT]

authenticdasein: what i get overall from @sugatam's keynote is that *children are soooo clever*. And that's a nice thought. #altc2010 [13:41GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 Sugata Mitra's work show's that problem-solving activities helps foster self-organised learning [13:41GMT]

HallyMk1: @dajbconf nope. Not there. Be interested to hear about the political economy of his work. Will see him at #cal11. #altc2010 [13:42GMT]

lucyrstone: Looking around the auditorium lots of smiles everywhere, much more positive than yesterday :-) #altc2010 [13:42GMT]

jak82: So for higher education where the lecturers are subject experts and not 'Doctors' is this more important for us? #altc2010 [13:42GMT]

sarahhorrigan: wonder how much application of knowledge occurs rather than simply learning facts? #altc2010 [13:43GMT]

dajbconf: Big fan of @Sugatam's work, but isn't this a variant of the transmission model using Google as proxy? ducks #altc2010 [13:43GMT]

aidej: Sugata Mitra must have some amount of air miles! :o) #altc2010 [13:44GMT]

ScottHibberson: #altc2010 enjoying @sugatam keynote, very amusing anecdotes about how children use technology [13:44GMT]

nixsight: Yes, he's talking about a variant of rote learning, but the point is, kids can do THIS much by themselves... #ALTC2010 [13:44GMT]

HughDavis: #altc2010 Not sure that reading the correct answer from Google is what we wanted? But a start - certainly. [13:44GMT]

VickiMcGarvey: #altc2010 as much as knowledge acquisition it shows alot about collaborative working [13:44GMT]

suukii: hmmm, beyond the hole in the wall has me thinking of Chomsky and our capacity to learn. Also wondering about measuring learning #altc2010 [13:44GMT]

dajbconf: Information search & analysis + reading comprehension = most essential skills for Primary education, says @Sugatam #altc2010 [13:45GMT]

nixsight: ...teachers need to be there to provide context & teach critical thinking. Which ties into that ACC quote. #ALTC2010 [13:45GMT]

dianebrewster: Some interesting research on home education of children that backs up S Mitra's work #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

dajbconf: . @Sugatam talking about self-organizing systems: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-organization #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

jsecker: Information search and analysis skills and reading comprehension essential in primary schools #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

nixsight: ENCOURAGE critical thinking, not teach. Whoops. #ALTC2010 [13:46GMT]

authenticdasein: .@lucyrstone @AJCann's point: exactly! She probably can teach herself! #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

heloukee: The importance of working in groups, emergence of self organising systems (Sugata Mitra) #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

helenbeetham: @HughDavis wd be interesting to assess transferable learning rather than hearing the kids read out - but it is very impressive #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

sharonlflynn: One child to one computer doesn't work, the group aspect is necessary. Sugata Mitra at #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

suukii: self organising systems - is there a challenge in timing? what if we have already learned to work in limiting manners? #altc2010 [13:46GMT]

JonPowles: Mitra's astonishing results only work when the students learn in groups. Self-organizing pedagogical structures emerge #altc2010 [13:47GMT]

sarahhorrigan: emergent properties have the life crushed out of them by pre-designated learning outcomes #altc2010 [13:47GMT]

virtualleader: Missing keynote live streaming for this: corporate induction- ppt and a darkened room :( #altc2010 http://ow.ly/i/3GWN [13:47GMT]

AJCann: @authenticdasein Except I'm not conviced that grannies can teach themselves computers from scratch (though I want to be) #altc2010 [13:47GMT]

tim_vincent: #altc2010 The amazing self-teaching capabilities demonstrated with access to e-resources came about only when working freely in groups. [13:47GMT]

gillferrell: #altc2010 Just enjoyed a lecture! Lots to provoke thought & fantastic speaker. V different to yesterday [13:47GMT]

Eingang: #altc2010 "Education is a self-organising system, where learning is an emergent phenomenon…" -- Sugata Mitra. [13:47GMT]

JonPowles: @nixsight Teachers? Or grandmothers? #altc2010 [13:47GMT]

Emmadw: Groups of 9 year olds good at working out search terms & evaluating resources - as good as MSc students. #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

helenbeetham: Education = social system. Learning = personal phenomenon. How learning happens is a difft qu from how education shd be organised. #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

sharonlflynn: Speculation: education is a self organising system, where learning is an emergent phenomenon. We cannot make it happen. S Mitra #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

authenticdasein: key self-organising systems. You can't make (all of) that happen, but you can set the stage @sugatam's keynote #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Emergent systems are always astonishing. When education is self organised, learning is an emergent phenomenon #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

AJCann: So if learning is a self organizing system, VLEs are bad news? #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

nixsight: Beautiful. Seriously. @sugatam #ALTC2010 [13:48GMT]

sarahhorrigan: much better Keynote than yesterday #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

heloukee: http://sugatam.wikispaces.com/ #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

HughDavis: #altc2010 Wow. Keynot e over: So fast? I must have been enjoying that! [13:48GMT]

tash_harden: "Education is a self organising system, where learning is an emergent phenomenon" - Sugata Mitra #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

dajbconf: . @Sugatam's wiki: http://sugatam.wikispaces.com #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

dianebrewster: Yeah! Systems Thinking :-) self organizing systems with emergent properties - about time Sys Thinking was applied to Edn :-) #altc2010 [13:48GMT]

markdrechsler: Enjoying the #altc2010 tweets a lot - keep them coming :) [13:48GMT]

traceymadden: Mitra: education is self organising system from which learning emerges #altc2010 [13:49GMT]

Emmadw: @HughDavis Though a skill to make sure you've found the right answer ... especially when you're 9 #altc2010 [13:49GMT]

cpjobling: Great talk @sugatem. well worth the price of admission! ;-) #altc2010 [13:49GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 very positive feedback from the twitter backchannel, personally, I enjoyed this keynote much more than yesterday's. [13:49GMT]

AnnalisaManca: Sugata Mitra: The child-driven education http://tinyurl.com/2do97cb #altc2010 #edchat #ukedchat [13:49GMT]

dajbconf: Ego gets in the way of adult self-organizing learning systems? #altc2010 [13:49GMT]

FieryRed1: #altc2010 depends what people actually do with the VLE [13:50GMT]

sarahhorrigan: ego affects adventure in adults, especially in learning #altc2010 [13:50GMT]

suukii: Sugata Mitra @sugatam perhaps adopts a rather less confrontational way of suggesting that the lecture/r may be redundant? #altc2010 [13:50GMT]

abbybarker: @Sugatam The librarians of the future salute you for this work! #altc2010 [13:50GMT]

Eingang: . @AJCann No, you need a group of 4 grannies plus a grandchild to watch over them. (-: #altc2010 [13:50GMT]

nixsight: @JonPowles Well, problem is, this is one thing that our teachers aren't always that good at. But grannies a time-limited resource. #ALTC2010 [13:50GMT]

sharonlflynn: Problem with adult learning is that they are not as adventurous as 9 year olds. They are afraid of making mistakes. @sugatam at #altc2010 [13:50GMT]

andypowe11: sigh... missed #altc2010 keynote to listen to rather uninformative 'update' (i use that term loosely) about uk gov g-cloud [13:51GMT]

helenbeetham: Sugata Mitra making some good points about psych difference betw children and adults learning - curiosity vs loss of face. #altc2010 [13:51GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam spoke through many holes in the wall - the wall of formalised education #altc2010 [13:51GMT]

nicwhitton: Sugata Mitra's talk excellent, but isn't motivation to find out the answers to the questions essential? #altc2010 [13:51GMT]

authenticdasein: @mattlingard it was similar, but had more stuff. and @sugatam was still very very good. #altc2010 you enjoy your DIY alt-c dinner 2nite! [13:51GMT]

dajbconf: Hawthorne Effect, Dweck's Mindsets & anti-individualism. #altc2010 [13:51GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 Sugata's Future of Learning Wiki at http://bit.ly/c1Gmjt [13:52GMT]

FieryRed1: #altc2010 so what's the difference with 40-50 year olds? [13:52GMT]

ravisandhu8: @Sugatam used technology to help Southern Indian children learn better spoken English, helping their accent #altc2010 [13:52GMT]

francesbell: People smiling and (apparently) learning in today's keynote #altc2010 [13:52GMT]

HallyMk1: @dajbconf cultural contexts 4 this work interesting. Shown in outcomes from participatory action research. Assume this factored in #altc2010 [13:54GMT]

ravisandhu8: Essential skills for primary school children http://ow.ly/i/3GXj @sugartam #altc2010 [13:54GMT]

ravisandhu8: @sugatam Speculation of learning http://ow.ly/i/3GXl #altc2010 [13:54GMT]

ravisandhu8: "A teacher that can be replaced by a machine, should be"... Arthur Clarke controversial? @sugatam #altc2010 [13:54GMT]

sverjans: Two key competences in Hole-in-the-wall and follow-ups: Reading Comprehension & Searching for information .@sugatam #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 Social learning with large groups (one controlling PC) ends in chaos, best to have groups of 4. (so, like the Crystal Maze then?) [13:55GMT]

ravisandhu8: "Children can set bars for learning much higher than educators can for them, don't under estimate them" @sugartam #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

ravisandhu8: The secret to children learning independently in India was for a supportive 'facilitator' @sugartam #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

ravisandhu8: "I'm from the traditional system, you hear from a lecture once and then you forget it" @sugartam #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

kevupnorth: (via @sharonlflynn) @sugatam at #altc2010: Adult learners not as adventurous as 9 year olds as they're afraid of making mistakes <-Disagree [13:55GMT]

andyjb: pico projection from mobile phone would be interesting #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

ravisandhu8: "A girl from Gateshead taught me more about Hinduism than I ever did in India" @sugartam #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

ravisandhu8: The secret to @sugatam method is groups of 2 to 5, rather than alone or any larger #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

marloft: Currently employing Grandmother method w/ 5 yr old on starfall.com She says: 'you just click when you need help with a word' #altc2010 [13:55GMT]

dajbconf: 'The Future of Learning' <--All learning? In what context? For what age children? And learning what? #altc2010 [13:56GMT]

sarahhorrigan: it takes time to free learners from the constraints of education. How to frame the question is the art of the teacher #altc2010 [13:56GMT]

geoffstead: > @sharonlflynn: One child to one computer doesn't work, the group aspect is necessary. Sugata Mitra at #altc2010 [13:56GMT]

bluplatypus: It's a great art to provide questions - art of good teaching? #altc2010 [13:56GMT]

HughDavis: #altc2010 The teachers role is to ask the (right) questions not to provide the answers [13:56GMT]

bensteeples: #altc2010 "the internet is full of answers, but not questions" [13:57GMT]

jiscdigital: #altc2010 Sugata Mitra: teaher's role isn't to provide answers but to provide questions. [13:57GMT]

Onkloud9: Sugata - the role of the teacher is to provide the questions not the answers #altc2010 [13:57GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam: Teacher's role changing but not redundant. Answers are all there. Teachers role is to provide the questions. #altc2010 [13:57GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 Sugata "we should refine the questions not refine the answers" [13:57GMT]

MSJACOB: #altc2010 @sugatam art of the teacher is asking the questions, not providing content [13:57GMT]

JonPowles: "not to get rid of teachers, but to redefine the role from the one who provides the content to the one who asks the questions" #altc2010 [13:57GMT]

suebecks: The teacher's role is to provide the question not the content Sugata Mitra #altc2010 [13:57GMT]

sharonlflynn: Teacher is not eliminated. Role is not to provide content, www has the content, but to ask the right questions. @sugatam keynote #altc2010 [13:57GMT]

ravisandhu8: "The teacher's role is not to provide the content, it is to provide the questions, that is the skilled teacher" @sugatam #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

dianebrewster: Teacher's role is to provide the questions not the answers Sugata Mitra #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

soharcaan: ALT-C 2010 (a conference) has been added to #soharc » social handle archive http://t.co/LrkjXbQ via @soharcaan #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

sarahhorrigan: why do we assume that adults don't have natural curiosity? We have it... but something hides it, surely? #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

andrewmid: #altc2010 engagement is about asking the right questions (again)! [13:58GMT]

dajbconf: It's the method that's good here. Hooks and stimulating curiosity = key. The 'self-learning' claim slightly spurious. #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

aidej: Sugata Mitra: "A teacher's role isn't to provide answers but to provide questions." #altc2010 [13:58GMT]

timbuckteeth: @sugatam believes the future of education is self organised but teachers will still play a role #altc2010 [13:59GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 is curiousity an emotion or an attractor? [13:59GMT]

emmadw: teacher's role is to provide questions - kids find answers. V. similar to the book I've just read by Prensky #altc2010 [13:59GMT]

vahva: @JudithELS thank you! Are you following the discussion on #altc2010? [13:59GMT]

fredgarnett: #altc2010 time to re-invent the wheel... [13:59GMT]

helenbeetham: @nicwhitton perhaps the questions asked are motivated by a 'hidden' curriculum? #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

ALT: Invited speakers Josie Taylor & Heather Fry 15:10-16:10 via Elluminate: http://ow.ly/2B5Js #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

nixsight: @dajbconf Self-learning looks like a happy side-effect of the key, though, right? #ALTC2010 [14:00GMT]

HughDavis: #altc2010 Sugata's message must be a real push for PBL? [14:00GMT]

Onkloud9: Sugata - Education is a self organising system, where learning is an emergent phenomenon #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

timbuckteeth: We could ask for a @sugatam encore... #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

heloukee: Triggers, attractors, curiosity and emergence - Sugata Mitra blows the crowd away #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

bluplatypus: Another great presentation - #altc2010 - you are spoiling us! [14:00GMT]

ravisandhu8: "A curriculum is based on curiosity, so we can take the children back, to inspire their curiosity" @sugatam #altc2010 [14:00GMT]

Thanks very much.You know, what of the things that's taught in business schools, in marketing courses, is not to raise expectations of the customer, because after that you can only go steadily downwards. Well, a sort of optimistically call this talk "The Future of Learning"Perhaps it should have been called a future of learning. But it's one of the futures which I think in the last eleven years or so, I have encountered in many different ways and that's the story I want to tell you. The first thing, a little breakdown of children on our planet. It's a sort of personal

One the things that's taught in business schools, in marketing courses,

is not to raise expectations of the customer,

because after that you can only go steadily downwards.

Well, I've sort of optimistically called this talk "The Future of Learning."

Perhaps it should have been called "A future of learning."

But it's one of the futures which I think in the last eleven years or so,

I have encountered in many different ways and that's the story I want to tell you.

The first thing, a little breakdown of children on our planet.

It's a sort of a personal number,these are difficult numbers to get,

you get different numbers from different sources.

But I would think that there are about 50 million children on the planet

who have more than everything that they need for their lives, for their education, for everything.

Then there are another, about 200 million below that, who have adequate resources.

And below that, there are 750 million who do not have adequate resources.

So this is the situation that we're in, we're looking at.

Here in Britain, I would think that we're dealing with

the first two blocks, and maybe the top slice of that 750 million.

That's the impression I get by going around the country.

Here are some sentences that I heard here in various cities, at various times, from various age groups:

"When I need to know something at the time when I need to know it, I can find out in five minutes."

"My father is an engineer, but he doesn't have a job."

"Why should I work hard to be a professor like you, when I can earn as much as you by driving a bus."

So, we need some answers to these questions.

They're important questions for children, and we don't actually have too many convincing answers.

We can give them the academic answer about knowledge and deep understanding, and so on and so forth,

but these are specific questions. We have to give specific answers.

On the other side of the world: "We can't use the computer room when we want, it's not allowed."

That's from India: "The internet is down because the school didn't pay."

So, that's the other side of the world. So then, if you put the problems together,

you have the problems of relevance and aspiration in the top part of the triangle,

and you have the problem of resources at the bottom.

So I will start from eleven years ago, with this sentence:

"There are places on Earth, in every country, where good schools cannot be built and good teachers either will not go or cannot go."

You know, when you first see this it's reminds you of the developing world, first of all. Of Africa, India, China.

But think of any country that you know, think of the map, and think that you have an imaginary pencil,

could you not mark out places where you'd say good teachers will not go there.

So it is not a developing country problem, it's a global problem.

Unfortunately, it's an ironic global problem because

those places where the good teachers won't go, are just the ones where they're needed the most.

So, we're stuck in a bind.

I will show you some figures here.

North eastern Indian, as you go further and further away from Delhi on the x-axis,

to 250 km away from Delhi, leaving all the urban areas behind,

the primary school scores drop sharply.

Why? Because the teachers 250 km away, if you ask them this question "Would you like to be somewhere else?"

The answers changed from "Not really" to "Absolutely."

By the time you hit 300 km, they say "If only I could get a job in Delhi, there's better health care, better entertainment, more shopping," etc.

Then I came to England, and I thought to myself:

Now I will not find this problem, because it's much more uniformly developed.

So then I should expect to see a flat distribution of primary school results.

Well, when I looked at the numbers that was not the case.

There were schools doing very badly and there were schools doing very well.

I started looking for relationships and very quickly found one in north eastern England.

The density of council housing correlates with the primary school results, the GCSE results in this case.

The more the density of council housing, the worst the results seem to be.

And this is pretty significant as you can see from that line, it's not a spurious thing, it's pretty sharply correlated.

So I went into those highly dense government housing areas, and I went to the schools,

and surprisingly I heard the same thing I heard in India.

I asked the teachers "Would you consider working in another school?"

And as soon as you go into the high-density council areas:

"It's very dangerous here, you know, it's not a nice area. The children are very rough. I wouldn't mind."

There are a few teachers who say "No. That's my challenge, I want to be here." But not all.

So, you do have that problem.

The remoteness in India was geographic. The remoteness here was socio-economic.

So, back to 1999.

1999 in New Delhi, the rich children all have computers.

It's a new toy, their parents have spent a lot of money, upwards of 1,000 pounds to buy them computers.

They're all very good with the computers.

All their parents say their children are geniuses because they are so good with computers.

Down in the slums, the children haven't heard of a computer ; they don't even know what it is.

And they're not going to make it because no computer teacher is ever going to go into a slum to teach.

So back in 1999, I tried an experiment.

I made an ATM-like structure into the wall of a slum, which eventually got called the "Hole in the Wall"

and put on the English internet and left it there.

And very quickly saw that the children were beginning to teach themselves how to use the computer.

This happened everywhere, including the desserts of Rajasthan.

Here's a dessert where of all things, in four hours,

the children were using the sound recorder to sing into the computer and listen to themselves sing... by themselves.

Down in south India, they were downloading games from Disney.com.

This game is to assemble a camera and then take a photograph.

Something that urban children would do all the time, but remember these children have seen a computer

only a few days ago, or a few months ago. They don't know any English.

They've taught themselves whatever English they needed to be able to do all this.

So I started to document this whole process and to measure on a computer literacy scale

what happens to groups of children, if you just leave a computer with them.

And the numbers were interesting.

It was a straight upwards curve reaching about 42 on that scale, which is what an office secretary can do.

If you give that test today to an office secretary here, she would get about 42, 45 percent.

So they were reaching that on their own in nine months.

This was the conclusion from that section of the work:

That groups of children can learn to use computers and the internet on their own, irrespective of who or where they are.

So it didn't matter what language they spoke in, it didn't matter how rich or poo they were.

And I tried this in India, in hundreds and hundreds of villages.

I tried it in Cambodia, I tried it in Africa, and everywhere we got the same result.

So in those days, this was an important result about computer literacy not having to be taught.

I could then say with some amount of confidence, that it doesn't matter if your school doesn't have

an excellent computer teacher.

You could still achieve the same results by simply allowing the children access.

But around this time, something different started to happen.

In the school where these computers had been placed in the schools in India, many of them, -I shouldn't do that-

many of them started to report improvements in English and mathematic scores.

I couldn't quite, actually English, science and mathematic scores.

I couldn't quite understand what was the reason for that because as far as I could tell,

the children were continuously playing games all the time.

But then I wasn't there to watch all the while.

So I started doing a set of experiments to see what could be the reasons why these scores were going up.

The first experiment was in Hyderabad, it's a big sprawling south Indian city.

Hyderabad has hundreds of little private schools, not for rich people but for poor people.

And the reason why these really ramshackle little private schools make money,

is because they promise to teach English.

And for that segment of Hyderabad society,

learning English makes a huge difference to the kinds of lives that these children will live later on.

So the parents, the poor parents pay whatever, usually around three to five pounds a month,

to send their children to these private schools.

The schools do their best to teach English, but the problem that I spoke about prevents them.

Good native-language English school teachers are not going tot teach in the slums of Hyderabad.

So they don't get native language speakers.

The children begin to copy the accents of the local Telegoo-speaking, Telugu is the language there, Telegu-speaking teachers.

Telegu accents are extremely hard to understand. So when the children come out of school,

they know a reasonable amount of English, their spelling is good, their handwriting is good,

their grammar is good, but when they go for a job interview,

the interviewer says "You're English may be good, but I don't understand what you're saying."

So they don't get the job.

So here was a problem that could not be solved by human teachers, because human teachers were not available.

So I had to use technology.

I looked at what's available and I must say I wasn't very happy with it.

I looked at all sorts of programs that tend to teach English.

In those days, 2002, there were none that specifically talked about pronunciation.

So what I did finally was I got a PC and I loaded a speech-to-text software on it,

you know the kind that you can get for free now with Windows.

What that does is that you take a microphone, you plug it into the PC,

you speak into the microphone and the PC will type out whatever you tell,

whatever you're saying, provided it understands you.

The system needs to be trained in the voice that it is expected to understand.

What I did was I bought this computer, I put in this software.

I trained it in a neutral English accent.

And then I blocked out the training function and gave it to a group of children in a private school in Hyderabad.

And they spoke into it and the computer started to type out complete nonsense.

So the children laughed and said it doesn't understand anything what we are saying.

So I said to them, "Well I'll leave this with you for two months,

you have to make yourself understood by the computer."

Now this is where the new method starting forming in my mind, because the children then asked:

"How do we do that?" And I said to them with great honesty,

"I don't know."

And anyway, I'm leaving.

So I left them, I left them.

What they did was incredible. They downloaded pieces of software.

They downloaded films, they downloaded the speaking Oxford dictionary, which I didn't know existed.

And they started to practice in groups, in other words, not only were they teaching themselves,

they had invented the pedagogy by which to teach themselves because I hadn't told them anything.

And the results were remarkable, to say the least.

[GIRL: Yes, he's my cousin.]

[RECORDING: Yes, he's my cousin.]

Clear flat English accent.

I don't have the video here of her speaking before the experiment, and she was barely understandable.

So, they had changed their accents. I published the work.

And at that time I began to realize that children perhaps would achieve educational objectives on their own,

if they had a reason to.

Which will bring us to the West in a little while, because in the West

the problem is that they don't seem to have a reason why they should do these things.

Some surprises in that period from 2002 to 2006,

was to start with, I got a message from Sir Arthur C. Clarke who was living in Colombo in those days,

And he had heard of my original experiment, he was interested.

And you know he was in a wheelchair, so I went to Colombo to meet him.

And he said two very interesting things.

The first thing is said was that "A teacher that can be replaced by a machine, should be."

OK, that's a double...

So, I teacher that can be replaced by a machine, should be.

The second thing he said was that "If children are interested, then education happens."

I then started to put in different educational objectives in a way that I will describe in a moment, into India,

into Cambodia and into Africa, to see what else would happen after the children had taught themselves to use a computer.

Here's Sir Arthur to start with.

[CLARKE: ... to help people because children frequently learn to navigate the web and find things that interest them.

When you got interest, then you have education."

BOY: This is my machine. I play games. WOMAN: Where did you find these games?

BOY: On animals and I listen to music. I am fifteen years old"

[The Hole in the Wall in Cambodia, April 2004]

COMPUTER: I've got five wins with three in each win. How many bullies to I have all together. Please try again. CHILDREN TALKING

So here's the kind of multiplication game that a child will not touch at home, but on the pavements they show off with each other.

COMPUTER: Keep good at division.

And back on the streets of Delhi, I discovered what was happening.