WEBVTT 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Hey, It's time for Windows Weekly. It's the show that sticks in your brain like a Windows 10 nag screen. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I'm Fr. Robert Ballecer, SJ. The digitial jesuit in for Leo the Fourth who is currently, on a boat. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 But of course, it's a special edition because we got Paul Thurott and Mary-Jo Foley, they are bringing the fire to Microsoft Ignite. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Uh, Mary-Jo, Paul, so good to see you, you're in some sort of? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary-Jo: It's a connector. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Paul: It's a connector. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I'm not sure what that means,at ome point you're going to have to tell me, but, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 You look good, you sound good, and it's nice to have you straight from one of the biggest microsoft events of the year. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Tell me, for the folks who haven't watched windows weekly, and are joining us for this show, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What is Microsoft Ignite supposed to be? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Paul: What is it supposed to be? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What it is, is the biggest show in the world for IT hosts 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 20,000 people 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary-Jo: 25 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -25,000 people, all of them crammed into this room Off of a small hallway between two gigantic conference centers 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary-Jo: It's the show for everything. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -It's like the show for all microsoft technologies. Windows, sharepoint, (inaudible)...everything you would like in one show, no xbox. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr. Ballecer) Wait, no xbox? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 There was a small bit of onedrive news this week, that justified my travelling here. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Now, every year at Ignite, we seem to be walking away with takeaways. Things that you like the most. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 You've had just a little bit of time and I understand it was a late night because 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary Jo decided you need to try every craft beer in Atlanta, But, what have been the big ticket items so far? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Big Picture, I would almost say security. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Yep, for sure. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Security, artificial intelligence, machine learning, as well. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Well the transformation of the cloud. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Right. -Which is kind of ongoing. -Definitely. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So I feel like the messaging we hear is microsoft is all in, in the cloud. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 All in on security. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 All in on sharepoint. I have to keep going back to sharepoint. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 - Who doesn't. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Everyone. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I know, security is pretty across the stack. When you think that its a big deal its not just high tech security 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Not just server icloud security 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It's security even in the fabric. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Right, it's a hybrid. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 The message was hybrid. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What microsoft means by hybrid cloud is a little more comprehensive than some of the other members. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I found a new way to get quite excited, Hybrid is an activity, right? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Oh, that would get her very agitated. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) Has there been much talk about Windows 10, internet of things edition? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 No. -No. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 A little but not alot. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Actually, there really hasn't been alot of windows 10 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 There was obviously some security enhancements in the anniversary update, some coming things as well. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Right. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Edge is getting some sort of security isolation technology. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That may or may not make it's way to other apps, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Browsers. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 - That was code named Barcelona. Did you know that? - Now I do. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Thats a really interesting feature because it's suppose to use containers in windows 10. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In the browser to isolate possible malicious attacks, and be able to detonate those to the side. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So, very interesting technology, something we'd heard rumored. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I thought it might have been a previous version windows 10. Never made it, so its looking like red stone 2. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Yea, Spring. -Spring. "Whatever that means". 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Some of the news has been trickling back here from the day 1 keynote when Scott officially made the announcement that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Windows 10 is now on 400 million devices. How solid of a number do you find that? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Of course we've dropped down from the official target of a billion devices by the end of the year. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Will they make half a billion before the holiday season? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Thats interesting. - I think so, do you? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So at the current clip, no. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Of course you see a seasonal bump because of the holiday. It's possible. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 They don't have that kind of a goal, right? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 They were talking about 1 billion active PC's by 2018. -2018 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That's moved out a bit obviously since the original proclamation. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Which I'm sure they regret. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 But they do still plan and expect to get up to 1 billion active devices. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Around that time or slightly later, perhaps. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 They still are saying 1 billion, yes. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Right, I would be surprised if they hit half a billion by the end of the year. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) Would that count devices that have been upgraded then downloaded several times? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Paul: Yea, that would get counted twice, ha ha! 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Because, I've got like 15 devices on this laptop. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Actually it's interesting as you move from selling software to store 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Where you can say we shipped x number of these boxes 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 To counting something that seems a little more ebulous 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Just monthly average users or in windows 10 case, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 active devices. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 This is actually an instance where this is a more meaningful real world number 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 because it's instances of the op system running and being used actively. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It's actual users, 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 In the past when ms used to sell 20 million in windows 7 licences a month. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It was a real sale. It was something they could put down in the books. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 But those things weren't neccesarily brought up and running 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Most of them probably were not a month 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That's the nature of that style of accounting. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think for normal people, looking for something that is a real world metric 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 active devices is a real good one this time -yea. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 An accurate one. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It does make it a little hard to compare it to previous versions 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 and how they were doing at this point 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 With windows 7 they weren't talking about active users. It was a different metric. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So, I think this a good metric. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think it means people are actually using it vs. just have it on a shelf somewhere. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 For use maybe one day. -Exactly. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Paul: Or maybe running another version because alot of time 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in windows 7 day, it's hard to imagine they would have went back to vista but 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 alot of businesses might have been running XP 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in other words, what they're buying is a windows 7 license 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 because thats what ms is selling but you get downgrade rights on that licence. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 They might have gone back to an earlier version of the OS 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Hard to tell from those numbers how many people were actually using it 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 which is why you see shared numbers from market share or whatever are kind of interesting. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 MS can look at how many machines are hitting win update everyday or whatever 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Mmhmm. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Get figures that way as well. -yep. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Would there be a better way to count this? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Is there a better metric that would show actual engaged windows 10 users? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think for windows this is the most accurate way to gage the success of this thing. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think this is the way to go. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 They don't do this with everything else. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 One of the things we sort of complain about is you try to understand how microsofts various businesses, they have 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 different ways of judging the success of different businesses 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 or products. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 When the xbox one fell behind the PS4 for example, they stop sellling 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 guess how many of these things they sold 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Now they talk about engagement. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Which is things like number of hrs. spent on xbox live. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 against number of hrs. playing games against other people.. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think those numbers have their value. -Yea. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Like with windows, I sort of feel like those sales mean something 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 because it's a retail product literally shipped in boxes -right. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 A sale's a sale. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Those kind of things make sense. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Obviously they're accounting for things in different ways depending on the product 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Have either of you been able to play at all or see a demo of one of the technologies that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 was announced at ignite? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That is that edge is gonna run in a micro vm 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 not a regular vm, but a very lightweight vm that should 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 sandbox it off completely from the rest of your system 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I'm excited by this, I saw a demonstration 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 of similiar technology that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 was released over at the intell developer forum 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 And I couldn't believe how far they come, it was so fast to load 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 it was basically a 15 milisecond delay over what you would get 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 just starting the app. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Is that hitting the floor, can you actually see it, or 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 is it in the preannouncement stage? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It's gonna come out to insiders first and it hasn't come out to them yet 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So, i dont think unless there's some sort of simulation demos 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I dont think so. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Paul: So its a RS2 feature, something thats gonna come 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in the spring. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It's probably gonna come to other applications in windows, in 3rd party apps, and 3rd party browsers 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary-Jo: Yes. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Which where it gets interesting. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Not because I feel that edge is ever going to have meaningful usage here but 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 You want to protect the whole range of users obviously 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 So hopefully that happens quickly as well 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Mary-Jo: If you go back and you look at what ms done in this space 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 they're were all these ms research projects 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 dating back 10 years 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Where they were trying to figure out what you could do 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in the browser 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 to isolate potential malware attacks, malware and other kinds of attacks 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 and I feel like this has finally becoming a product 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 now that they've researched all that 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Other things like gazelle, all these weird code names coming out of 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 ms research 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 where they were doing the work in that space 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I feel like this thing barcelona, has to do with containers, windows 10 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 is kind of the fruition of all that. -yea 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Maybe maturing is the wrong way, but sort of an evolution 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 on thinking behind security for a long time was trying to 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 proactively figure things out 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 use machine learning and different things 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Frankly, we're almost at the point now you want to control 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 the scope of damage so we sort of almost accept that on a clients system someway 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 something is gonna happen. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If you can relegate that and have it stay in that one place 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 you're impacting the security of everybody in a very positive way 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 that's a very important thing to do 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I think this edge and some of the other things we see 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 in windows 10, office 365, across the stack 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 is kinda aimed at that. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 These things are gonna happen 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Let's just isolate it to the place where it happens Mary Jo: yea 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 And prevent it from spreading. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) I like that idea that this is gonna spread to other apps of the programs in the windows ecosystem 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 or even 3rd party because 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 ultimately, isn't this where we go 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 If windows 10 becomes really secure, shouldn't it essentially become a hypervisor 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 and everything and just runs in micro vms 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Todd: Right its almost the universal windows app 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 universal windows pocket app model 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 contain everything, virtualize everything 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 and keep everything seperate from each other Mary Jo: Right. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Apply to security. -yup. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 What needs to happen between now and then? So what's holding us up from running everything in vm? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 This has actually been in the news for windows for quite a while 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 that windows 10 was gonna support this. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It seems like only the enterprise nerds are really excited about it 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That's where it hits first Mary Jo: Right. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Where hypervisors are already are in windows 10 containers 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 is the enterprise version 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 It's gonna be there first, I would guess. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Todd: It's a step too, isolation technologies 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 is whatever form they take 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Containers and whatever kind. App v or med v back in the day 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 These are the type of technologies (I'm getting attacked, heh) (Mary Jo laughing) 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 That debut in the enterprise 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Both laughing!) 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 I'm literally collecting flys. Mary Jo: You are! 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) Welcome to Atlanta! 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Todd: I had BBQ for lunch, I.. Mary Jo: Lemme try again 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 -Yea, hit me please 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Thud!) 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) Ha! Ha! Ha! 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Sorry, I kinda got it 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) She wasn't even aiming for the fly! 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Sorry. -That really hurt. 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 We have to talk a little about Assure, about cloud 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Of course that's been a big focus 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Something I heard on the keynote 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Surprised me, was that ms really liked this idea of pushing for assure as just not a service platform 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Not something you just drop something else on top of 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Which seems to be a little counter trend that we're seeing in the industry 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 More and more vendors are coming out like vm ware saying 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 "We want you to not care about what cloud service you're on" 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 "In fact, we want you to use multiple cloud services without being able to tell the difference" 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 (Fr.) Why is ms going in that direction? 99:59:59.999 --> 99:59:59.999 Are you talking more hybrid now?