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Οι άντρες ονειρεύονται τις γυναίκες
Οι γυναίκες ονειρεύονται τον εαυτό τους να τις ονειρεύονται

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Οι άντρες κοιτούν τις γυναίκες
Οι γυναίκες βλέπουν τον εαυτό τους να τον κοιτούν

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Οι γυναίκες διαρκώς συναντούν βλέματα που λειτουργούν σαν καθρέφτες

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υπενθυμίζοντας τους την εμφάνισή τους ή πώς αυτή θα έπρεπε να είναι.

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Πίσω από κάθε ματιά υπάρχει μια κρίση.

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Κάποιες φορές η ματιά μου συναντούν είναι η δική τους, αντανακλούμενη από έναν πραγματικό καθρέφτη.

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Μια γυναίκα πάντα συνοδεύεται, εκτός όταν

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είναι τελείως μόνη της. Και μπορεί ακόμα και τότε, από

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την εικόνα του ίδιου της του εαυτού. Καθώς περπατάει,

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διασχίζοντας ένα δωμάτιο, ή κλαίγοντας για τον θάνατο του πατέρα της

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δεν μπορεί να αποφύγει να συλλαμβάνει τον εαυτό της, να περπατάει ή να κλαίει

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από την παιδική ηλικία, διδάσκεται και πείθεται να επιθεωρεί τον εαυτό της συνεχώς

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Πρέπει να επιθεωρεί όλα όσα είναι και όλα όσα κάνει διότι

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Ο τρόπος που εμφανίζεται στους άλλους και ειδικότερα ο τρόπος που εμφανίζεται στους άντρες

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είναι ζωτικής σημασίας, καθότι

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[music]

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A woman in the culture of privileged Europeans,

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is first and foremost a sight to be looked at.

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What kind of sight is revealed in the average European oil painting

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There were portraits of women as there were portraits of men.

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but in one category of painting, women were the principle

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ever occuring subject, that category was the nude.

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In the nudes of European painting, we can discover some of the criteria

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and conventions by which women were judged.

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We can see how women were seen.

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What then is a nude?

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In his book on the nude, Kenneth Clark says that being

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naked is simply being without clothes

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the nude, according to him, is a form of art

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I would put it differently.

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To be naked is to be oneself.

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To be nude is to be seen naked by others and

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yet not recognized as oneself. A nude

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has to be seen as an object in order to be nude.

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In the European oil painting, nakedness is not taken for granted

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as in archaic art. Nakedness is a sight for those who are dressed.

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That is why Manners's painting which really marks the end of a period I am considering is so

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profound a comment on all the works that preceded it.

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the story begins with the story of Adam and Eve as told in Genesis.

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And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and it was a delight for the eyes,

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and that the tree was desired to make one wise

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she took of the fruit thereof and did eat

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and she gave also to her husband with her, and he did eat.

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and the eyes of them both were opened, and they

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knew that they were naked

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and the Lord God called out to the man and said

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Where art thou? and he said

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I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid

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and I hid myself

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unto the woman God said, "I will greatly

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multiply thy sorrow and thy conception. In sorrow, thou shall bring forth children,

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and they desire will be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."

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Two things are striking about this story.

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They become aware of being naked because, as a result of

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eating the apple, each sees the other differently

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nakedness is created in the mind of the beholder.

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The second striking fact is that the woman

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is blamed and is punished by being made subservient to the man

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In relationship to the woman, the man becomes the agent of God.

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In medieval art, the story is often illustrated scene following scene

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as in a strip cartoon.

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During the Renaissance, the narrative sequence disappears, and the single moment

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which is nearly always depicted, is the moment of shame.

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The couple wear fig leaves or make a modest gesture with their hands

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but now, their shame is not so much in relationship to one another as is to the spectator.

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It is the spectator looking which shames them.

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Later, as painting became more secular,

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many other subjects offer the opportunity for painting nudes.

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But always in the European tradition, the nude implies an awareness of being seen

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by the spectator. They are not

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naked as they are, they are naked as you see them.

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Often, as with the favorite subject of Suzanna and the elders,

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this is the actual theme of the picture.

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We join the elders to spy on her.

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She looks back at us looking at her.

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Sometimes the woman, Suzanna, looks at herself

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in the mirror, picturing herself as men see her.

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She sees herself first and foremost as a sight

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which means as a sight for men.

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Thus the mirror is a symbol of the vanity of women

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yet the male hypocrisy in this is blatant.

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You paint a naked women because you enjoy looking at her

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you put a mirror in her hand, and you call the painting vanity

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thus morally condemning the woman whose nakedness you have

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depictured for your own pleasure

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And thus, incidentally, repeating the biblical incident by

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blaming the woman

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The Judgement of Paris is another famous mythological subject with the same

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in written idea of looking at naked women and judging them.

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Paris awards the apple to the woman he finds most beautiful.

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Beauty in this context is bound to become competitive.

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The judgement of Paris is transformed into a beauty contest.

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Aesthetics when applied to women are not

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as disinterested as the word beauty

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might suggest

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I don't want to deny the crucial part that seeing

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plays in sexuality, but there's a great difference in being seen

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as oneself naked or being seen by another in that way

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and a body being put on display

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To be naked, is to be without disguise.

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To be on display, is to have the surface of one's own skin,

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the hairs of one's own body

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turned into a disguise.

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A disguise which cannot be discarded.

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Amongst the tens of thousands of European oil paintings

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of nudes, there are perhaps 20 or 30 exceptions, paintings in which the

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artist has seen the woman revealed as herself.

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this Rubens

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this Rembrant

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this George De La Tour

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These paintings are as personal as love poems

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and their character is quite distinctive

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Most nudes oil paintings have been lined up

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by their painters for the pleasure of the

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male spectator only

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who will assess and judge them

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as sights

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Their nudity is another form of dress

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They are condemned to never being naked

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with their clothes off, they are as formal

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as with their clothes on

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Those who are not judged beautiful, are not beautiful.

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Those who are, are given the prize.

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The prize is to be owned.

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That is to say, to be available.

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Charles II commissioned this secret painting

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from Lale. It's like hundreds of others,

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it might be Venus and Cupid, but

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in fact, it was a portrait of one of his mistresses Nell Gwen.

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He chose her passively looking at the

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spectator staring at her naked.

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Her nakedness is not an expression of her own feelings

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it is only a sign of her submission to his demand

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The painting, when he shows it to others,

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demonstrates this submission. His guests envy him.

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By contrast, in another tradition, nakedness is a celebration of

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active sexual love as between two people,

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the woman as active as the man

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the actions of each absorb the other.

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In oil painting, the second person or the second

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person who matters it the person looking at the painting.

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Compare these two women.

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One the model for what is considered a masterpiece by Eng

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and the other an ill paid model for a photograph in a girly magazine

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Or these two

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just the expresssion, the look,

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what do you see?

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It seems to me that in each pair, the expression

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is remarkably similar, and it is an

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expression of responding with remarkable charm

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to the man who she knows is looking at her

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although she doesn't know him

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It is true that sometimes a painting includes

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a male lover, but the woman's attention is very rarely

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directed towards him. She looks away from him

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or she looks out of the picture towards he who

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considers himself her true lover, the spectator-owner

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this painting was sent as a present from the Grand Duke of Florence to the King of France

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The boy kneeling on the cushion and kissing

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is Cupid the woman is Venus

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But the way her body is arranged has nothing to do with

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that kissing. Her body is arranged the way it is to display it

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to the man looking at the picture

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the picture is made to appeal to his sexuality

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it has nothing to do with her sexuality

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The convention of not painting the hair on a woman's body helps towards the same end.

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Hair is associated with sexual power, with passion.

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The woman's sexual passion, needs to be

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minimized, so that the spectator feels

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that he has the monopoly of such passion.

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There were paintings which depicted

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male lovers. These did exist.

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But they were mostly private, semi-pornographic

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pictures. In most paintings, which were painted to be seen

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rather than hidden, the only rival to the male

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spectator is a cupid.

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Now, how extraordinary it is that the

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pictorial symbol of passion is a small boy.

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For a similar reason, women in the European art of the oil painting are seldom seen dancing.

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They have to be shown languid, exhibiting a minimum of energy.

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They are there to feed an appetite, not to have any of their own.

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The appetite was theoretically gargantuan.

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The absurdity of this male flattery, although it was not seen as absurd then

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reached its peak in the public academic art of the 19th C

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prime ministers discussed under paintings like this

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when one of him felt he had been outwitted, he looked up for consolation

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the nude in European oil painting

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is usually presented as an ideal subject

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it is said to be an expression of the European humanist spirit

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I don't want to reject entirely the truth of this,

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but I have tried to add to it

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starting off from a different viewpoint.

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Duer who believed in the ideal nude

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thought that this ideal could be constructed

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by taking the shoulders from one body

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the hands of another, the breasts of another,

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and so on

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Was this humanist idealism?

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Or was it the result of the indifference

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to who any one person really was?

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Do these paintings celebrate

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as we're normally taught

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the women within them?

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or the male voyeur?

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Is there sexuality within the frame?

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or in front of it?

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I showed the program, as you have seen it, up to now, to five women.

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It began to seem absurd that the only images

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that you are seeing are of women

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silent, mute

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So, I showed it to them and asked them to comment.

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To comment not so much on the program

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but rather on the questions raised by it

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Above all, on the question of how men see women

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or how they have seen them in the past.

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And how this influences the way women see

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themselves today.

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We have an image, of

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Of course, we all have an image of ourselves

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and it is a visual image, but I wonder how

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much this sort of classical European painting

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has shaped that image.

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In my own case, I find it quite impossible when I

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look at the paintings you show, in your film, I can't

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take them seriously, I cannot identify with them

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because they are so immensely exaggerated.

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Always, you know, they fasten onto some secondary

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sexual characteristic, these enormous breasts,

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these beasting bottoms, those huge things like that

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and they just aren't real. Whereas with

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photographs, you can feel that as potentially, possibly

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although it probably isn't. Many of these paintings you show are idealized.

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Um, and therefore, they are to me very unreal.

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in connection with any deep down image that I might have of myself

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or in connection with any deep down

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pleasure I might have

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when looking at another female body

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they don't give me that pleasure at all

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I can admire then as paintings

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but they don't mean human beings to me

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the image that I compare myself to

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is the photograph because it is with photographs

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00:16:40,154 --> 00:16:42,692
that I have been encouraged to think of myself

244
00:16:42,692 --> 00:16:45,040
in this way, it is essentially advertising to me

245
00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:49,216
that has made me think of myself in this way

246
00:16:49,216 --> 00:16:50,534
and consequently, I find it extremely interesting to go

247
00:16:50,534 --> 00:16:53,171
back and think of nudes in this way because

248
00:16:53,171 --> 00:16:55,326
I have never done so, but having seen the film

249
00:16:55,326 --> 00:16:57,866
I have no doubt that the same thing applies.

250
00:16:57,866 --> 00:17:01,882
And do you find the nudes in painting unreal

251
00:17:01,882 --> 00:17:04,846
in the same way? yes.

252
00:17:04,846 --> 00:17:08,439
Well, you can't get any information from it,

253
00:17:08,439 --> 00:17:12,688
can you ? there's no guide to how you might--

254
00:17:12,688 --> 00:17:13,454
what information is lacking?

255
00:17:13,454 --> 00:17:19,085
well, activity. Dynamism. it is how

256
00:17:19,085 --> 00:17:20,593
someone sees you and that's all,

257
00:17:20,593 --> 00:17:23,166
it is laid upon you.

258
00:17:23,166 --> 00:17:25,259
I'm glad you showed the men in picture

259
00:17:25,259 --> 00:17:28,245
because I always find this extremely shocking

260
00:17:28,245 --> 00:17:32,398
the men are dressed and the women are naked

261
00:17:32,398 --> 00:17:35,097
and this seems to sum up the entire situation

262
00:17:35,097 --> 00:17:39,529
because these women as well being humiliated

263
00:17:39,529 --> 00:17:40,752
and I think this is part of the whole

264
00:17:40,752 --> 00:17:42,356
scheme of things

265
00:17:42,356 --> 00:17:44,129
as most people have had, at some station

266
00:17:44,129 --> 00:17:49,209
in life, nightmares about running through the streets with nothing on

267
00:17:50,229 --> 00:17:51,905
while everyone else is dressed. And this seems

268
00:17:51,905 --> 00:17:52,991
to me to be one element in the picture.

269
00:17:52,991 --> 00:17:55,338
One very interesting thing you said in the film was

270
00:17:55,338 --> 00:18:01,026
about how nudity was really a kind of disguise,

271
00:18:01,026 --> 00:18:03,827
it wasn't the real person themselves free.

272
00:18:03,827 --> 00:18:07,135
But it was just another garment they were wearing

273
00:18:07,135 --> 00:18:09,035
and worse than a garment, in a sense, because

274
00:18:09,035 --> 00:18:11,023
it was something that you can't take off.

275
00:18:11,023 --> 00:18:13,211
This comes, I think, from

276
00:18:13,211 --> 00:18:16,878
nudity being combined with a pose. And that's

277
00:18:16,878 --> 00:18:18,610
inevitable if you're going to have a painting

278
00:18:18,610 --> 00:18:25,718
of a model. Um, in a way, I think that

279
00:18:25,718 --> 00:18:28,617
we're always dressing. We're always dressing up

280
00:18:28,617 --> 00:18:31,350
for a part. Always putting on a uniform of one kind of another

281
00:18:31,350 --> 00:18:33,280
and I think women do this more than men

282
00:18:34,048 --> 00:18:38,288
men have only been doing it fairly recently.

283
00:18:38,288 --> 00:18:41,668
Women are always dressing to show the kind of

284
00:18:41,668 --> 00:18:45,172
character that they want to present: the mother, the working

285
00:18:45,172 --> 00:18:48,775
woman, the pretty young chick. And nudity

286
00:18:48,775 --> 00:18:53,724
is a uniform, in a way, for I'm ready

287
00:18:53,724 --> 00:18:57,356
for sexual pleasure. So, it doesn't. You can't

288
00:18:59,423 --> 00:19:04,925
identify being nude with being free.

289
00:19:04,925 --> 00:19:06,245
Only just recently read that book

290
00:19:06,245 --> 00:19:10,388
which describes a way in which a woman

291
00:19:10,388 --> 00:19:14,022
is reduced to the sexual pleasure she can

292
00:19:14,022 --> 00:19:17,560
to a complete object provide to a man. And what struck me in all that book

293
00:19:18,671 --> 00:19:21,626
that was the most impressive image is the fact that she was told

294
00:19:21,626 --> 00:19:24,941
that she was never to touch her own breasts to

295
00:19:24,941 --> 00:19:29,221
close her own mouth or to put her legs

296
00:19:29,221 --> 00:19:32,304
together. So, the whole point about her stance

297
00:19:32,304 --> 00:19:33,430
all the time is that she was available

298
00:19:33,430 --> 00:19:38,254
and this sense of being available of waiting

299
00:19:38,254 --> 00:19:41,824
for other people is the very antithesis of action

300
00:19:41,824 --> 00:19:46,097
and you know just like the Brook Street

301
00:19:46,097 --> 00:19:47,807
Bureau advertisement, Tony hasn't run. He's

302
00:19:47,807 --> 00:19:49,971
three minutes late in ringing. You feel this whole

303
00:19:49,971 --> 00:19:53,030
situation, the number of women you talk to who

304
00:19:53,030 --> 00:19:57,343
say I stay in so many night a week, waiting for someone to ring

305
00:19:57,343 --> 00:19:59,958
the concept of availability implies

306
00:19:59,958 --> 00:20:02,941
passivity because if you're simply waiting for someone else to act

307
00:20:04,143 --> 00:20:06,501
then you can't help yourself.

308
00:20:06,546 --> 00:20:09,254
yes, it's like you will awake when a man touches

309
00:20:09,663 --> 00:20:14,710
you when a man kisses you. Whether its an excuse,

310
00:20:14,710 --> 00:20:17,954
to get yourself going, I think women are shy

311
00:20:21,905 --> 00:20:25,339
they are waiting too long.

312
00:20:25,603 --> 00:20:26,889
yes, yes.

313
00:20:27,112 --> 00:20:29,131
Could I say something now about narcissism?

314
00:20:29,131 --> 00:20:32,031
I think that both men and women are narcissistic

315
00:20:32,031 --> 00:20:35,178
but in different senses, and I think

316
00:20:35,178 --> 00:20:38,811
that one in sometimes I have the impression

317
00:20:38,811 --> 00:20:41,702
that men and women are tremendously

318
00:20:41,702 --> 00:20:44,252
narcissistic and are cut off from each other

319
00:20:44,252 --> 00:20:46,558
from their images of themselves. But

320
00:20:46,558 --> 00:20:49,840
whereas a woman's image of herself is derived

321
00:20:50,526 --> 00:20:53,553
directly from other people, the mirror you're talking about

322
00:20:53,553 --> 00:20:56,985
a man's image of himself is derived from

323
00:20:56,985 --> 00:21:00,534
the world that is its the world that gives him back

324
00:21:00,534 --> 00:21:08,757
his image because he acts in it. and the women are drawn to him as a source, as central activity,

325
00:21:08,757 --> 00:21:11,072
and as a source of worth

326
00:21:11,924 --> 00:21:13,754
since he is in the world, the fact

327
00:21:13,754 --> 00:21:17,650
that he values her is important

328
00:21:17,650 --> 00:21:21,212
and so because their centers of narcissism are different,

329
00:21:21,212 --> 00:21:23,943
and the woman's is essentially only

330
00:21:23,943 --> 00:21:27,322
related to the other person

331
00:21:27,322 --> 00:21:28,648
she is in a much more passive position than he is

332
00:21:28,648 --> 00:21:30,052
in relation to it

333
00:21:30,052 --> 00:21:32,915
yes

334
00:21:32,915 --> 00:21:35,188
do you see narcissism as essentially a negative

335
00:21:36,932 --> 00:21:40,530
or positive phenomenon?

336
00:21:40,530 --> 00:21:44,259
well, i think that is very difficult to answer

337
00:21:44,259 --> 00:21:48,118
but in the sense that it is related to

338
00:21:48,118 --> 00:21:50,657
an identity, um, it is a positive phenomenon

339
00:21:50,657 --> 00:21:53,521
and it seems to me that what women envy in men in that

340
00:21:53,521 --> 00:21:54,993
they have a sense of their

341
00:21:54,993 --> 00:21:56,702
own identity

342
00:21:56,702 --> 00:21:58,023
that there is something in them

343
00:21:58,023 --> 00:22:00,136
that is important to them other than

344
00:22:00,136 --> 00:22:02,267
simply what other people think of them

345
00:22:02,267 --> 00:22:03,833
and I think that thing

346
00:22:03,833 --> 00:22:07,594
is product of their interaction in the world

347
00:22:07,594 --> 00:22:12,099
and it is almost as if through this interaction

348
00:22:12,099 --> 00:22:15,701
they build up a store of worth

349
00:22:15,701 --> 00:22:17,625
of their sense of themselves

350
00:22:17,625 --> 00:22:20,643
which is a constant

351
00:22:20,643 --> 00:22:22,417
it cannot be lost

352
00:22:22,417 --> 00:22:24,055
and because a woman doesn't go out

353
00:22:24,055 --> 00:22:25,245
and do that

354
00:22:25,245 --> 00:22:26,660
she doesn't create a store

355
00:22:26,660 --> 00:22:30,136
she waits for the present interaction with a man

356
00:22:30,136 --> 00:22:32,512
that can go, that can end at any moment

357
00:22:38,120 --> 00:22:41,568
there is something here that really

358
00:22:43,501 --> 00:22:45,581
I would like to push around a little bit

359
00:22:45,721 --> 00:22:48,736
because narcissism is a very pronounced

360
00:22:48,736 --> 00:22:52,976
way of stating a relationship with the world

361
00:22:52,976 --> 00:22:55,834
whether it is a man or a woman

362
00:22:55,834 --> 00:22:59,851
but this other question which is contained

363
00:22:59,851 --> 00:23:05,930
within it, but doesn't go as far as it as an idea

364
00:23:05,930 --> 00:23:10,563
is this sort of self delight of a person

365
00:23:10,563 --> 00:23:11,390
whether or it is a man or woman

366
00:23:12,884 --> 00:23:14,752
in life, in what they're doing

367
00:23:14,752 --> 00:23:19,800
in relationships with a man or woman

368
00:23:21,703 --> 00:23:27,271
and it is a thing that matters tremendously

369
00:23:27,271 --> 00:23:30,259
and its not only a thing that is an inner thing

370
00:23:30,259 --> 00:23:32,031
by which you life

371
00:23:32,031 --> 00:23:34,177
but it is a very outer thing

372
00:23:34,177 --> 00:23:38,875
by which you gain relationships with

373
00:23:38,875 --> 00:23:40,192
your own context in the world

374
00:23:40,581 --> 00:23:43,831
that you can't gain any other way

375
00:23:43,831 --> 00:23:47,264
its when you've somehow been made

376
00:23:47,264 --> 00:23:49,868
so unconscious of yourself that

377
00:23:49,868 --> 00:23:53,086
you easily, naturally,sort of

378
00:23:53,086 --> 00:23:58,548
compulsively go out to whatever is around you

379
00:23:58,548 --> 00:24:01,639
now, when you're a child that tends

380
00:24:01,639 --> 00:24:05,657
with people to be other things

381
00:24:05,657 --> 00:24:06,943
doesn't it?

382
00:24:06,943 --> 00:24:11,351
mountains, streams, whereever you go

383
00:24:11,351 --> 00:24:17,493
and then only gradually as you go on

384
00:24:17,493 --> 00:24:25,877
you make this kind of absolutely necessary contact with people

385
00:24:25,877 --> 00:24:30,926
but I do think that the sort of essense

386
00:24:30,926 --> 00:24:35,749
of self delight as a kind of possible thing

387
00:24:35,749 --> 00:24:38,225
in the modern world and something

388
00:24:38,225 --> 00:24:41,434
that fewer women have than men and want and must have

389
00:24:42,662 --> 00:24:46,747
is the power, the compulsion, not the power

390
00:24:46,747 --> 00:24:51,853
the compulsion to make contact with the world

391
00:24:51,853 --> 00:24:53,409
as you are living in it

392
00:24:53,409 --> 00:24:54,489
and when I'm saying that I don't

393
00:24:54,489 --> 00:24:57,580
simply mean the people next door

394
00:24:57,580 --> 00:25:00,344
I mean what is going on

395
00:25:00,344 --> 00:25:02,279
yes

396
00:25:02,279 --> 00:25:04,168
I am not so sure about the delight

397
00:25:04,168 --> 00:25:06,264
I think it is a very double edged thing

398
00:25:06,264 --> 00:25:07,798
I know

399
00:25:07,798 --> 00:25:09,921
as I suppose I've always known

400
00:25:09,921 --> 00:25:11,397
that I became aware of it in this film

401
00:25:11,397 --> 00:25:13,968
I've never consciously looked at myself in

402
00:25:13,968 --> 00:25:16,741
the mirror and seen myself as I am

403
00:25:16,741 --> 00:25:18,505
I always see the image that I want

404
00:25:18,505 --> 00:25:20,206
I know that I want to

405
00:25:20,206 --> 00:25:21,626
and my children notice it that if I make up

406
00:25:21,626 --> 00:25:23,365
my face I put on a certain expression

407
00:25:23,365 --> 00:25:27,152
if I , from adolescence on, if I have seen myself

408
00:25:27,152 --> 00:25:28,891
naked in the mirror, I have not thought of

409
00:25:28,891 --> 00:25:31,385
myself naked, I have thought of myself as a nude

410
00:25:31,385 --> 00:25:34,642
and I think this comes from having been trolled

411
00:25:34,642 --> 00:25:37,084
around all the major art galleries

412
00:25:37,084 --> 00:25:40,687
in essence, this is culture, this is beauty

413
00:25:40,687 --> 00:25:42,100
with a capital B

414
00:25:42,100 --> 00:25:44,127
and, of course, up to a point from advertising too

415
00:25:44,127 --> 00:25:46,437
but much more from the painting

416
00:25:46,437 --> 00:25:51,286
um, that you think the female body is beautiful

417
00:25:51,286 --> 00:25:53,402
I am a beautiful object, if not, I have to do

418
00:25:53,402 --> 00:25:55,176
something about it

419
00:25:55,176 --> 00:25:57,164
um, and therefore, the painful part

420
00:25:57,164 --> 00:26:00,351
of a narcissistic society is the feeling of inadequacy

421
00:26:00,351 --> 00:26:03,337
this business of always posing in a mirror

422
00:26:03,337 --> 00:26:08,651
I think one does absolutely automatically

423
00:26:08,651 --> 00:26:11,379
and if you actually catch yourself

424
00:26:11,379 --> 00:26:15,108
in a mirror by chance that is not deliberately

425
00:26:15,108 --> 00:26:18,158
because you're getting dressed or having a bath

426
00:26:18,158 --> 00:26:21,090
there's one in the street, or you catch yourself

427
00:26:21,090 --> 00:26:23,174
in a shop window, it's a tremendous shock

428
00:26:23,174 --> 00:26:25,850
because you suddenly see yourself as you are

429
00:26:25,850 --> 00:26:27,902
which is windblown, untidy, badly dressed

430
00:26:27,902 --> 00:26:30,443
tired, and so on

431
00:26:30,443 --> 00:26:31,859
you don't see the person

432
00:26:31,859 --> 00:26:34,110
at all, and I think this is what happens to women

433
00:26:34,110 --> 00:26:35,874
they are always trying to measure

434
00:26:35,874 --> 00:26:39,642
up to this erotic image that is projected.

435
00:26:39,642 --> 00:26:42,566
There are some paintings

436
00:26:42,566 --> 00:26:45,423
and I'm thinking at this moment of one painting

437
00:26:45,423 --> 00:26:47,293
where there is a woman

438
00:26:47,293 --> 00:26:48,803
who is wearing a garment

439
00:26:48,803 --> 00:26:52,077
she is not nude

440
00:26:52,142 --> 00:26:54,240
but it is a garment so loose, so comfortable

441
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,096
so easy, and its my idea, very much

442
00:26:57,096 --> 00:27:02,757
of what a picture of a woman might be like

443
00:27:02,757 --> 00:27:06,582
I think its from a period before yours,

444
00:27:06,582 --> 00:27:08,898
it's so long ago by Lorenzetti

445
00:27:08,898 --> 00:27:12,404
it's a fresco, very very old

446
00:27:12,404 --> 00:27:14,743
and it is a picture of a woman

447
00:27:14,743 --> 00:27:16,646
who is suppossed to represent peace

448
00:27:16,646 --> 00:27:18,318
it's quite extraordinary

449
00:27:18,318 --> 00:27:20,280
she could be one of the liberated

450
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:22,690
or trying to be liberated young women

451
00:27:22,690 --> 00:27:25,708
of today. she is at ease, she is relaxed

452
00:27:25,708 --> 00:27:29,123
she is not playing the part at all

453
00:27:29,123 --> 00:27:31,920
she is able to combine

454
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,774
pleasure with thought

455
00:27:34,774 --> 00:27:36,898
and with dreaming

456
00:27:36,898 --> 00:27:38,695
and she is, she might spring into action

457
00:27:38,695 --> 00:27:40,011
at any moment

458
00:27:40,011 --> 00:27:41,969
and for me

459
00:27:41,969 --> 00:27:43,937
she has much, much more to do

460
00:27:43,937 --> 00:27:49,107
with nakedness, with oneself, with the

461
00:27:49,107 --> 00:27:53,644
truth of oneself than any other nudes I have seen

462
00:27:54,122 --> 00:27:58,340
[music]