1 00:00:11,034 --> 00:00:14,049 Many of you in this room have been reading in the 2 00:00:14,049 --> 00:00:17,396 papers over the last few days about what's going on in Syria. 3 00:00:17,396 --> 00:00:21,768 And probably you are as appalled as anyone else 4 00:00:21,768 --> 00:00:25,265 of the images of mass killing on all sides, 5 00:00:25,265 --> 00:00:28,787 of the taking of innocent life of children, women, 6 00:00:28,787 --> 00:00:30,585 completely defenseless people. 7 00:00:30,585 --> 00:00:32,786 And you're probably asking yourselves: 8 00:00:32,786 --> 00:00:36,879 "Why isn't anything being done to stop it?" 9 00:00:36,879 --> 00:00:41,446 I want to talk a little bit about the system of international rules 10 00:00:41,446 --> 00:00:44,029 that allows you to begin to answer that question. 11 00:00:44,029 --> 00:00:48,298 And I want to do it by reference to a case to have come to, 12 00:00:48,298 --> 00:00:52,818 as I conclude, that took place ultimately in the Houses of Parliament. 13 00:00:52,818 --> 00:00:55,597 The judgment given in November 1998 14 00:00:55,597 --> 00:00:58,499 in a case that many of you would be familiar with involving 15 00:00:58,499 --> 00:01:03,046 senator Augusto Pinochet. Decisive moment that goes 16 00:01:03,046 --> 00:01:06,025 very closely to the kinds of issues we're talking about 17 00:01:06,025 --> 00:01:07,710 when we ask the question: 18 00:01:07,710 --> 00:01:13,593 "Why isn't president Assad being stopped from killing?" 19 00:01:13,593 --> 00:01:16,031 I work as an international lawyer. You've probably have 20 00:01:16,031 --> 00:01:18,024 heard about international law. You probably don't know 21 00:01:18,024 --> 00:01:22,015 a huge amount about what international law is. 22 00:01:22,015 --> 00:01:25,459 It's traditionally described as the rules that govern 23 00:01:25,459 --> 00:01:27,089 the relations between states. 24 00:01:27,089 --> 00:01:30,990 I wake up in the morning, I switch on my computer, 25 00:01:30,990 --> 00:01:34,301 I have emails about the sort of cases and issues that I'm involved in: 26 00:01:34,301 --> 00:01:40,912 the protection of human rights in the former Yugoslavia, the cases of Vukovar; 27 00:01:40,912 --> 00:01:45,735 the right to return of the Chagossians to the Island of Chagos, 28 00:01:45,735 --> 00:01:48,167 part of the decolonization problems involving 29 00:01:48,167 --> 00:01:53,033 the United Kingdom and a load of other cases. 30 00:01:53,033 --> 00:01:55,914 And classically the world that I deal with, 31 00:01:55,914 --> 00:01:58,582 is a world between states, 32 00:01:58,582 --> 00:02:01,064 it's a world which governs relations between 33 00:02:01,064 --> 00:02:05,054 the two hundred or so countries that occupy the world. 34 00:02:05,054 --> 00:02:08,096 If you were to step back from this planet, jump up to the moon, 35 00:02:08,096 --> 00:02:12,083 and look at how we organize ourselves 36 00:02:12,083 --> 00:02:14,288 you'd think it's pretty weird. 37 00:02:14,288 --> 00:02:18,969 We've divided ourselves into about two hundred countries 38 00:02:18,969 --> 00:02:21,803 and the basic idea of international law is that 39 00:02:21,803 --> 00:02:26,492 within those two hundred countries -- and it used to be 40 00:02:26,492 --> 00:02:29,801 only forty or fifty in the 18th and 19th centuries -- 41 00:02:29,801 --> 00:02:35,045 states, governments are free to do whatever they want 42 00:02:35,045 --> 00:02:36,846 to their citizens. 43 00:02:36,846 --> 00:02:40,166 They can torture them, they can kill them, 44 00:02:40,166 --> 00:02:41,711 they can disappear them, 45 00:02:41,711 --> 00:02:44,025 they can adopt rules saying that, you know: 46 00:02:44,025 --> 00:02:46,033 "every female over the age of sixty is going to be killed," 47 00:02:46,033 --> 00:02:49,490 "every male under the age of fifteen is going to be killed." 48 00:02:49,490 --> 00:02:52,644 The classic rules of international law are premised on 49 00:02:52,644 --> 00:02:59,621 the concept of sovereignty, the power -- absolute power of the state. 50 00:02:59,621 --> 00:03:04,076 That changed dramatically in the 20th century 51 00:03:04,076 --> 00:03:08,032 and it's the idea that is at the heart of that change, 52 00:03:08,032 --> 00:03:13,047 the idea that finally gives a role and a place for an individual 53 00:03:13,047 --> 00:03:17,321 that is at the heart of the answer to the question that I posed at the outset 54 00:03:17,321 --> 00:03:21,034 and that dominates the answer to that question. 55 00:03:21,034 --> 00:03:24,093 It's the one that I want you to think about. 56 00:03:24,093 --> 00:03:29,435 What happened? We know about the atrocities in Stalin's Soviet Union. 57 00:03:29,435 --> 00:03:32,758 We know about the atrocities in Germany 58 00:03:32,758 --> 00:03:36,037 and in many occupied countries in the '30s and in the '40s 59 00:03:36,037 --> 00:03:38,063 and the argument of the government of those countries 60 00:03:38,063 --> 00:03:41,068 at the time was: "Well, we may have domestic rules 61 00:03:41,068 --> 00:03:43,721 that limit what we can do but there's no rule of 62 00:03:43,721 --> 00:03:46,711 international law that stops the killing." 63 00:03:46,711 --> 00:03:49,869 Individuals have no rights. 64 00:03:49,869 --> 00:03:53,092 A very small number of people in the middle part of the 20th century 65 00:03:53,092 --> 00:03:59,177 started developing the idea that actually individuals did have rights. 66 00:03:59,177 --> 00:04:03,396 And the rights of individuals were exercisable against state. 67 00:04:03,396 --> 00:04:08,027 For the first time, ever, the very recent idea 68 00:04:08,027 --> 00:04:10,376 an individual could stand up and say: 69 00:04:10,376 --> 00:04:14,062 "You Mr President are not allowed to do that. 70 00:04:14,062 --> 00:04:17,349 You are subject to constraints, not the constraints of 71 00:04:17,365 --> 00:04:19,704 your domestic legal order but the constraints of 72 00:04:19,704 --> 00:04:22,777 your international legal order." 73 00:04:22,777 --> 00:04:25,025 And that's what culminated in the creation of instruments 74 00:04:25,025 --> 00:04:28,048 that many of you are very familiar with: 75 00:04:28,048 --> 00:04:30,012 the Universal Declaration on Human Rights, 76 00:04:30,012 --> 00:04:33,043 the European Convention on Human Rights and then 77 00:04:33,043 --> 00:04:36,011 other instruments that emerged in the late 1990s like 78 00:04:36,011 --> 00:04:38,710 -- also in 1998 the year of the Pinochet case, 79 00:04:38,710 --> 00:04:42,041 the statute of the International Criminal Court. 80 00:04:42,041 --> 00:04:45,209 In fact that was the year that was vital for another reason, 81 00:04:45,209 --> 00:04:47,580 in that same year - 1998 - for the first time ever, 82 00:04:47,580 --> 00:04:52,024 for the first time in human history, a serving head of state 83 00:04:52,024 --> 00:04:55,592 was indicted by an international court: 84 00:04:55,592 --> 00:04:59,091 Slobodan Milošević. It had never happened before. 85 00:04:59,091 --> 00:05:04,283 Now that is a vital change. A change which is premised on 86 00:05:04,283 --> 00:05:09,414 the very simple idea that individuals have rights against their state. 87 00:05:09,414 --> 00:05:13,710 That was a development that was hard fought for 88 00:05:13,710 --> 00:05:16,080 and which, I have to say right now, is under challenge 89 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:20,681 and under threat. Why? Well, many of you remember 90 00:05:20,681 --> 00:05:23,051 the events of September 11th 91 00:05:23,051 --> 00:05:27,020 and with the events of September 11th a number of governments 92 00:05:27,020 --> 00:05:30,049 that had been at the heart of promoting the idea that 93 00:05:30,049 --> 00:05:34,547 "every human person has rights", an idea reflected for the 94 00:05:34,547 --> 00:05:37,075 first time in a very obscure document called 95 00:05:37,075 --> 00:05:41,054 the 'Atlantic Charter' adopted in 1941 by Churchill and 96 00:05:41,054 --> 00:05:45,928 Roosevelt, that idea that "every individual has rights, 97 00:05:45,928 --> 00:05:50,005 whoever they are, wherever they may be, in whatever 98 00:05:50,005 --> 00:05:53,088 circumstance they may find themselves in" is now under 99 00:05:53,088 --> 00:05:57,089 threat from those who promoted the very idea. 100 00:05:57,089 --> 00:06:00,063 Why is it under threat? Well, many of you are familiar with 101 00:06:00,063 --> 00:06:03,008 the stories about banging people up because they are alleged 102 00:06:03,008 --> 00:06:06,052 to be terrorists and holding them without charge 103 00:06:06,052 --> 00:06:10,090 indefinitely for the rest of their lives -- I wrote a book about that. 104 00:06:10,090 --> 00:06:13,076 About and individual Mohammed al-Qahtani arrested in 105 00:06:13,076 --> 00:06:19,465 2002 still detained at Guantanamo, has not being charged, 106 00:06:19,465 --> 00:06:24,185 has no release date and it appears will be held for the rest 107 00:06:24,185 --> 00:06:28,648 of his natural life because of a 'so called' war on terror. 108 00:06:28,648 --> 00:06:32,077 You're familiar with the idea of "drones", the idea that 109 00:06:32,077 --> 00:06:35,428 all of a sudden because we are 'at war' 110 00:06:35,428 --> 00:06:38,058 we are free as a nation, 111 00:06:38,058 --> 00:06:41,935 or as Americans, to define individuals who pose 112 00:06:41,935 --> 00:06:45,681 a threat to our society and just take them out. 113 00:06:45,681 --> 00:06:50,482 Other people call that extrajudicial killing. 114 00:06:50,482 --> 00:06:54,168 It's done in Afghanistan and it's extended beyond the war-zone 115 00:06:54,168 --> 00:06:58,746 to places like Pakistan and to places like Yemen. 116 00:06:58,746 --> 00:07:00,693 Well, if you are going to take people out 117 00:07:00,693 --> 00:07:03,828 because they are alleged Al Qaeda individuals in Pakistan 118 00:07:03,828 --> 00:07:07,048 why not do it in Edgware? Where do the limits stop? 119 00:07:07,048 --> 00:07:10,366 When you start deciding you are simply going to eliminate those 120 00:07:10,366 --> 00:07:15,451 individuals abandoning the rules that were put in place 121 00:07:15,451 --> 00:07:19,002 in that remarkable period in the decade after 122 00:07:19,002 --> 00:07:20,086 the Second World War. 123 00:07:20,086 --> 00:07:25,020 So, we face a fundamental challenge in relation to 124 00:07:25,020 --> 00:07:29,097 whether we care about these rights. The idea the individual 125 00:07:29,097 --> 00:07:34,072 is now an actor on the international stage and has rights 126 00:07:34,072 --> 00:07:39,057 exercisable not only in relation to his or her fellow individuals 127 00:07:39,057 --> 00:07:44,033 but against the state. And rights not just before national courts, 128 00:07:44,033 --> 00:07:47,020 rights before an international court and international instances. 129 00:07:47,020 --> 00:07:52,754 That was a hard fought victory in the 1940s 130 00:07:52,754 --> 00:07:56,982 it was unique, for millennia there had not been such rights 131 00:07:56,982 --> 00:08:00,519 and yet there are now people in this country, too 132 00:08:00,519 --> 00:08:04,818 in this parliament also who say the time has come for 133 00:08:04,818 --> 00:08:09,004 the United Kingdom to withdraw from the European Convention 134 00:08:09,004 --> 00:08:11,278 on Human Rights. Because, why? Because they don't like 135 00:08:11,278 --> 00:08:15,039 judgments about prisoners' voting rights or they don't like 136 00:08:15,039 --> 00:08:18,014 the way in which certain immigrants are allowed to have 137 00:08:18,014 --> 00:08:22,020 certain rights but that is the essence of human rights. 138 00:08:22,020 --> 00:08:26,022 That is the essence of the system that was put in place, 139 00:08:26,022 --> 00:08:30,662 is that no one falls into a black hole. 140 00:08:30,662 --> 00:08:36,064 Everyone has minimum rights at all times and in all circumstances. 141 00:08:36,064 --> 00:08:39,141 And at the heart of that idea is the place of 142 00:08:39,141 --> 00:08:46,161 every human individual having indivisible rights to be exercised at all times. 143 00:08:46,161 --> 00:08:51,701 Now, I mentioned this building Parliament and why it was significant. 144 00:08:51,701 --> 00:08:55,330 On the 24th of November 1998 I was involved 145 00:08:55,330 --> 00:08:59,033 in receiving a judgment in a case that I've been involved in -- 146 00:08:59,033 --> 00:09:02,664 the Pinochet case. And in sense the case articulated the 147 00:09:02,664 --> 00:09:07,136 moment when the idea of individual rights became very real. 148 00:09:07,136 --> 00:09:11,327 What was an issue? Some of you will remember what happened. 149 00:09:11,327 --> 00:09:16,143 Senator Pinochet came to the United Kingdom, for medical treatment. 150 00:09:16,143 --> 00:09:19,047 He took tea with some rather powerful friends and 151 00:09:19,047 --> 00:09:22,049 then one day out of the blue a knock came on the door 152 00:09:22,049 --> 00:09:25,799 and he was arrested. Arrested for allegations of international 153 00:09:25,799 --> 00:09:31,033 crimes committed in Chile very far away not even against 154 00:09:31,033 --> 00:09:33,176 British nationals. 155 00:09:33,176 --> 00:09:37,012 The idea was posited on something called 'universal jurisdiction' 156 00:09:37,012 --> 00:09:43,773 the idea that some crimes: torture, disappearing, killing on a significant scale, 157 00:09:43,773 --> 00:09:47,193 crimes against humanity that are so terrible 158 00:09:47,193 --> 00:09:51,029 that any country can exercise jurisdiction in relation to those crimes. 159 00:09:51,029 --> 00:09:54,039 And a Spanish prosecuting judge decided to indict 160 00:09:54,039 --> 00:09:57,708 senator Pinochet for those crimes and he was in England, 161 00:09:57,708 --> 00:10:02,861 an arrest warrant was issued seeking his extradition to Spain. 162 00:10:02,861 --> 00:10:05,435 Senator Pinochet did exactly what one would 163 00:10:05,435 --> 00:10:11,025 expect him to do, he said: "You can't arrest me, I am the State." 164 00:10:11,025 --> 00:10:14,033 That's the 19th century view of international law. 165 00:10:14,033 --> 00:10:19,056 'L'Etat, c'est moi.' I have absolute power and you 166 00:10:19,056 --> 00:10:23,081 the English courts, the Law lords on the House of Lords are 167 00:10:23,081 --> 00:10:27,051 not entitled to overwrite my immunity. 168 00:10:27,051 --> 00:10:31,883 The case was argued for quite a few days and a couple of 169 00:10:31,883 --> 00:10:34,541 weeks after it was argued we trotted off to 170 00:10:34,541 --> 00:10:37,035 the Chamber of the House of Lords, when the grand old tradition 171 00:10:37,035 --> 00:10:39,693 has changed now, we got a Supreme Court, 172 00:10:39,693 --> 00:10:43,506 five Law Lords stood up in turn to give the judgment. 173 00:10:43,506 --> 00:10:46,412 It was the single most decisive 174 00:10:46,412 --> 00:10:49,479 and defining moment of my professional life 175 00:10:49,479 --> 00:10:54,034 in which the system of international rules, the old system, was cast away. 176 00:10:54,034 --> 00:10:58,933 Never before had any former head of State been held 177 00:10:58,933 --> 00:11:01,087 in the courts of this country or any other country outside 178 00:11:01,087 --> 00:11:08,392 his own to be not entitled to claim immunity for a mass crime. 179 00:11:08,392 --> 00:11:12,092 And the Law Lords took their vote, very soon on we would 180 00:11:12,092 --> 00:11:18,344 two nil down. Two out of the five had voted for immunity. 181 00:11:18,344 --> 00:11:23,009 And then it was 2-1 and then it was 2-2 and there was one 182 00:11:23,009 --> 00:11:26,532 judge left to express a view and at the moment when 183 00:11:26,532 --> 00:11:31,002 that judge articulated his view things were very finely balanced. 184 00:11:31,002 --> 00:11:36,987 You go with the old system: absolute immunity for former head of State. 185 00:11:36,987 --> 00:11:39,013 Or do you go with the new system? 186 00:11:39,013 --> 00:11:43,068 The system that says individuals have rights 187 00:11:43,068 --> 00:11:47,021 and that right includes the right to proceedings, legal proceedings against 188 00:11:47,021 --> 00:11:51,021 people who commit crimes that are particularly heinous. 189 00:11:51,021 --> 00:11:56,039 And the fifth judge -- the fifth judge said 'no immunity' 190 00:11:56,039 --> 00:12:00,529 and at that moment you can hear, you can still see it on 191 00:12:00,529 --> 00:12:03,022 the CNN website, the BBC website if you go to the archive 192 00:12:03,022 --> 00:12:06,940 there was certain sharp intake of breath. 193 00:12:06,940 --> 00:12:10,044 It was a remarkable moment because it was the moment 194 00:12:10,044 --> 00:12:15,026 more than any other where one recognised that the system 195 00:12:15,026 --> 00:12:21,104 had indeed changed and there's no room for complacency. 196 00:12:21,104 --> 00:12:25,972 A lot has happened since then. It's extraordinarily important 197 00:12:25,972 --> 00:12:30,012 that we do not lose the right of individuals to be protected 198 00:12:30,012 --> 00:12:33,900 against their own governments at any time. 199 00:12:33,900 --> 00:12:38,052 Every single person in Syria who is subject today in Homs 200 00:12:38,052 --> 00:12:44,040 or elsewhere, to the kind of heinous terrible indiscriminate attacks 201 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:47,059 that are taking place is entitled to turn around to us 202 00:12:47,059 --> 00:12:51,548 and to say, to us and to our governments: 203 00:12:51,548 --> 00:12:55,043 "You adopted a new system in the middle of the last century, 204 00:12:55,043 --> 00:12:59,983 you are required to respect that system 205 00:12:59,983 --> 00:13:03,041 and you are required to protect us from this kind of 206 00:13:03,041 --> 00:13:05,300 system that is taking place." 207 00:13:05,300 --> 00:13:08,007 That is the new system of international law. 208 00:13:08,007 --> 00:13:11,104 That is the new set of rules that were talked about 209 00:13:11,104 --> 00:13:13,635 for the person who spoke, sang wonderfully credibly movingly 210 00:13:13,635 --> 00:13:16,091 just before me. 211 00:13:16,091 --> 00:13:19,853 That is a system which reflects a single idea: 212 00:13:19,853 --> 00:13:23,634 the place of the individual in international society. 213 00:13:23,634 --> 00:13:25,957 And I invite you all to think about it 214 00:13:25,957 --> 00:13:28,071 and to defend it with everything you have. 215 00:13:28,071 --> 00:13:30,056 Thank you very much. 216 00:13:30,056 --> 00:13:32,007 (Applause)