1 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:04,000 [//// PLEASE DO NOT ALTER THE NUMBER OF LINES][Vance Stevens] Welcome everybody. 2 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:13,000 This is Vance Stevens in Abu Dhabi and we're in a Learning 2gether session on June 23rd, 2013. 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:18,000 We have an interesting story about how this session started. 4 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:23,000 I suppose I should let the participants introduce themselves, but very briefly: 5 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:33,000 we're going to be talking about a MOOC, LTIS13, a cMOOC that found Learning 2gether 6 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:39,000 and we can talk a little bit about how that happened and how this session came about. 7 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:41,000 But we'd like to welcome our participants. 8 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:54,000 I'm not sure if I might leave somebody out, but we've got Fabrizio Bartoli and we've got Luisella Mori and Gioachino 9 00:00:55,000 --> 00:01:08,000 and, I suppose, all participants of the MOOC, and we've got Lucia - let's see, she's also - Bartolotti - Lucia Bartollotti. 10 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:12,000 And if anybody else is here, they can introduce themselves. 11 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:18,000 Rita has joined us from Argentina and Claire has joined us from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. 12 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:29,000 And so, let the people in LTIS13 introduce themselves. How are you today? 13 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:38,000 [Fabrizio Bartoli] Hello everybody, I'm Fabrizio Bartoli and I'm a teacher. 14 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:49,000 I teach English as a foreign language here, in Acireale with children between 11 and 13 at the scuola media. 15 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:59,000 I joined this MOOC a few weeks ago and - we're going to talk about it in a few minutes. 16 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:04,000 I leave the mike to Luisa maybe. 17 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,000 Or Lucia, do you want to introduce yourself? 18 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:24,000 I don't - I can go on, but I think we're having a round in introducing ourselves, am I right? 19 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:35,000 [Vance Stevens] Yeah: let's -- anybody who wants to speak, introduce themselves and say why you're here. 20 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:40,000 That includes Rita and anybody else just joining us. 21 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:52,000 [Claude Almansi] Sono Claude e -- I am Claude and I am also a participant in the LTIS13 MOOC. 22 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,000 I'll leave the mike to someone else as well. 23 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:05,000 [Luisella Mori] I'm Luisella from Italy and I'm also a participant in this MOOC. 24 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:20,000 [Vance Stevens] OK, well, I'll tell the interesting story about how LTIS13 found Learning 2gether. 25 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:31,000 Errh, as you know, I just ported all our Posterous recordings, our archives of Learning 2gether into WordPress 26 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:39,000 and it was - yes, oh, Lucia, now we didn't hear you. Let me get you to introduce yourself, you press the Talk button. 27 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:47,000 The Talk button is just below the big black space: it probably says "Vance Stevens" on it right now. So you can try. Go ahead. 28 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:55,000 [Lucia Bartolotti] OK, now -- Oh yes, now you can hear me: I can see the icon of the microphone. 29 00:03:55,000 --> 00:04:00,000 OK, this is Lucia from Trieste, which is in the North of Italy. 30 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:04,000 I'm very glad to be here and let's see what we can do together. 31 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:11,000 [Vance Stevens] Great, OK. So nice to meet all of you. 32 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:21,000 There's a feature in WordPress that allows people -- well, first of all, I should say that I'm getting quite -- 33 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:25,000 when I started the WordPress blog -- I'm getting a lot of spam posts. 34 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:29,000 So I'm a little bit wary about things that are coming to my e-mail. 35 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:38,000 And one of those things that started coming was I found people from this MOOC were reposting my blogs 36 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:47,000 and I wasn't sure why they might do that -- maybe I can find the link with the comments in a moment, where you can see how it happened -- 37 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:58,000 but I didn't understand what they were doing, but Lucia came -- commented on my comment and explained that they had just started this MOOC. 38 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:02,000 And they seemed like friendly people, as cMOOC people are, so -- 39 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:11,000 and we are a MOOC-like kind of group, we have something called Electronic Village Online, 40 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:16,000 which you surely, from Italy, are welcome to join us. 41 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:25,000 We can talk more about that later, but it's a serious of lots of -- it's been going on since 2001, I think. 42 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:30,000 So for the last 10 years, there have been annual sessions, but we can tell you more about that. 43 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:40,000 But it's kind of a MOOC, so we're -- the people in our group are trying very much to share information with one another across the world. 44 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:56,000 And so, that's how we hooked up and Lucia and Fabrizio and Luisella and Claude and Gioachino - I'm sorry I'm mispronouncing this -- 45 00:05:56,000 --> 00:06:03,000 but in any event, they all participated in the MOOC and they agreed to come and join us to tell us more about it. 46 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:07,000 So I think that's what Fabrizio is going to start to do right now. (6:07) 47 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:19,000 [Fabrizio] I happened to reblog a post with an interesting webinar and... 48 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:27,000 And that's what I usually do, I mean, I just find something interesting on the Web 49 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:32,000 - it might be a webinar , or a resource or a tutorial about a Web tool - 50 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:42,000 and either I bookmark on Diigo and then share it with my -- with the group, I mean, or on my blog. 51 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:51,000 And I was in this - it is a group-- a MOOC and it is a Diigo group as well. 52 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:55,000 And so I thought they might be interested in joining. 53 00:06:55,000 --> 00:07:04,000 So I just did it. It was a bit naive maybe, but I just reblogged it without any comments. 54 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:11,000 And after that I thought, OK, it was a bit rude of me, not saying anything, why and all this stuff 55 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:20,000 You hardly ever have the time to do all that ... you just, you know,click the button and go on to the next thing. 56 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:28,000 But it was, it was nice, it was -- you know, we had the chance to meet together 57 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:40,000 and I had the chance to meet Vance again, because I followed one of his webinars with the EVO session this year 58 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:54,000 and I thought it was a great chance to put the two things together, two really big events. And with really experienced people. 59 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:06,000 [Vance Stevens] Well, I'm quite interested in your MOOC, and especially this document that you and Lucia - and Claude I believe - have been working on 60 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:13,000 and that's the one that's on the screen - on the webshare right now. 61 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:19,000 And if you scroll through it, you can find that -- let me read something from it if I can find it. 62 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:26,000 There's a philosophy: "Who should join this MOOC?" Let me see if I can find it, just scrolling down. 63 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:34,000 But that's worth commenting on if I - I'm getting way down here. Here we go. 64 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,000 "Potential inhabitants of the MOOC: 65 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:43,000 Those who fear everything will disappear if they press the wrong key: this village is for them. 66 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:47,000 Those who are thinking 'Where the deuce are the instructions?' 67 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:51,000 Well, they don't have to like this method, maybe this method is not for them." 68 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:57,000 [paraphrasing] There are different ways to do these things... They might decide to go somewhere else, but this is a rich and varied way of working. 69 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,000 "On the contrary, those who are fed up with strict instructions" 70 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:10,000 [paraphrasing] who will see different points of view and engage in critical thinking, will like this MOOC. 71 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:15,000 "Those who already know it all don't really need to be here", of course. 72 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:17,000 I like the way that's expressed. 73 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:25,000 "Those who think they're going to get some university credits here", they're wasting their time anyway. [quote marks checked] So 74 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:32,000 you can see that there is a philosophy here that's very much in keeping with George Siemens's philosophy of MOOC. 75 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:43,000 He says that he likes this way of teaching, because he thinks that chaos is necessary in learning 76 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:48,000 and where, as you've said, where the instructions are already there, 77 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:57,000 George Siemens says that the instructor is setting the paths for the student to walk and the student learns better if the student finds his own path. 78 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:08,000 So that's one of-- his famous philosophy in an interview he gave with Howard Rheingold, he expressed it like that. 79 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:19,000 So, well, tell us more about your MOOC: how did your MOOC get started, and - oh, someone has just shifted the screen over to Learning 2gether, 80 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:26,000 which is what we're doing right now: this event, you can see, is our June 23rd event that's announced here. 81 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:34,000 So, how did you start the MOOC? How did you come to participate in it? What did you learn from it? And so on. (10:34) 82 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:46,000 [Lucia] OK, so I'll start. I'm a member of teachers' network, which is called "La scuola che funziona" 83 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,000 - in English it is "the school that works" - 84 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:54,000 and they sent a newsletter, informing all members that this thing was going to start. 85 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,000 So I just registered. 86 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:04,000 I didn't expect anything because I was sure I would leave in a couple of days. 87 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:10,000 So I said "Well, I'm just going to lurk and see what happens," and then I got hooked. 88 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:19,000 And this is very much the philosophy of our professor. He said sometime during the course: 89 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:28,000 "We want to hook our students, and then to hold them, and then to launch them into new worlds. 90 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:37,000 This is the only way we can convince them to face the challenge and try and learn. 91 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:41,000 And this is very true for all students, even our students, I think. 92 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:44,000 On to somebody else. [11.51] 93 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:57,000 [Fabrizio] I don't know if anybody else would like to have a go with the microphone? 94 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,000 Otherwise I can go on. 95 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:19,000 I got to know about this MOOC because I was in another university course with University Line, "Lingue nella rete" 96 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:23,000 and they advertised the MOOC, it sounded interesting. 97 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:28,000 It was the first one I actually had seen here in Italy. 98 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,000 So I said: "Why not?" 99 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:37,000 And as I tried to explain in my "impressions" that I -- posted them beforehand -- 100 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:45,000 it was really different from any former experiences of MOOCs. (12:45) 101 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:59,000 Here, you had no fixed assignments, no -- very flexible times and as I said, a lot of talking 102 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:07,000 nice talking, very high quality talking about things that mattered for education, 103 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:13,000 the philosophy behind what we do when we use technology and when we try to integrate technology, 104 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:20,000 a lot of coding, which was something really new to me and I'm-- am willing to learn. 105 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,000 It's a hard job. 106 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:31,000 And a lot of people with a great experience behind, so, really a lot to learn, I mean. 107 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:43,000 [Vance] You're probably familiar with the -- the videos of Dave Cormier. 108 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:47,000 He's put up videos about how a MOOC progresses, 109 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:53,000 for example it starts off with declaring your intentions, why you are there in the MOOC. 110 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:58,000 And then he works through orienting in the MOOC, 111 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:04,000 and then networking with other people, eventually collaborating with them. 112 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:11,000 And he says that the main thing that you take away from a MOOC is the network. 113 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:18,000 And I find that to be so true: when I interact in a MOOC, I generally meet people that I didn't know before. 114 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:21,000 Did you find that to be true? I mean, your network -- 115 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:30,000 well, one reason I'm interested is that is because our networks collided at the WordPress blog and that brought us together. 116 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:33,000 And so, here again, we increase our network, we find like-minded people 117 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:41,000 in other places that, you know, that gives us other people to follow and to learn more about what they do 118 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:44,000 and to bring them as -- how learning together works. 119 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:54,000 So, did you find that you met a lot of new people in the cMOOC that you just finished? 120 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,000 Did you know each other before, the people who are here now, or did you meet just in the MOOC? 121 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:08,000 [Fabrizio] Ah no. Personally I didn't know anybody: I didn't know Lucia, didn't know Claude, Luisella 122 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:13,000 or, you know, Andreas, who is the teacher and a super teacher (15:13) 123 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:14,000 nobody at all. 124 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:24,000 It was a pleasure because being an English teacher, I'm always searching for English resources, 125 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:34,000 English websites and in English language and having to do with technology and -- it's exactly the same. 126 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:43,000 But now I'm finding out that there are lots of resources thanks to this MOOC and 127 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:58,000 It's true Claude: we had a ..very strong chat on the Google Drive, talking about the Italian resources and--- we'll keep on later. 128 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:09,000 But I think, yes, things are improving a lot in Italy and there are a lot of people I didn't even know of and they are doing a good job. (16:08) 129 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:16,000 It was a very important chance to meet other people here in Italy, 130 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:27,000 doing-- getting interested and involved in technology and online courses. 131 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:42,000 [Vance] Do you find that, as an English teacher in Italy, do you find it hard to, in your context, let's say, that is where you speak English 132 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:44,000 and all of you could address this. 133 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:49,000 First of all, you're an English teacher. I don't really know what the others do. 134 00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:52,000 Were the people in the MOOC mostly English teachers or the -- 135 00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:57,000 For example, Rita teaches English, Claire teaches English, I'm an English teacher. 136 00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:06,000 So, we're like-minded in that way and we expand our networks through participation in MOOCs, and also in learning 2gether, 137 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:12,000 and in a community we call WebHeads, and other communities that we follow as well, 138 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:16,000 TESOL for example, Teachers of [English to] Speakers of Other Languages. 139 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:19,000 I met Claire first through that, many, many years ago. 140 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:28,000 So, do you find that it's difficult to connect with like-minded teachers if you don't use a MOOC 141 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:35,000 or the MOOC -- did it, you know, expand your horizons to find out there other people who thought like you? [17.35] 142 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:44,000 [Lucia] Well, there are a couple of questions there. 143 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:53,000 I already knew a few of my colleagues, here in the MOOC but the vast majority was unknown to me. 144 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:57,000 And the vast majority was not made of teachers of English. 145 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:02,000 I think most of them are teachers from primary school, 146 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:06,000 because primary school teachers are very innovative here in Italy, 147 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,000 they're very active and creative, 148 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:18,000 and so they like joining in and sharing new ideas, they are very interactive, so to speak, 149 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:23,000 But interaction in the cMOOC started from the start. 150 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:31,000 I need to explain a little how it worked so that your guests can understand how it did work, 151 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:37,000 So it started from the professor's blog. 152 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:43,000 He already had his blog and he used it to give us the first instructions. 153 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:56,000 And the interesting thing is that at the second post he published, there were as many as, I think, 260-something comments. 154 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:02,000 And people already started interacting there. 155 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:07,000 So they would - they would speak to each other through comments, 156 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:15,000 for example: "Oh you Davide, comment number so and so, I would like to tell you this and that." 157 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,000 So interaction started from the very start. 158 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,000 This was very interesting. 159 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,000 [Vance] Did you find the comments overwhelming? 160 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:36,000 I notice -- I'm just looking at the figures: there were almost 500 people, thousands of comments. 161 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:39,000 How do you keep up with so many comments? 162 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:42,000 Or do you find that you can't keep up with so many comments? 163 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:48,000 One of the things -- one of the steps in the MOOC that Cormier points out is where you cluster. 164 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:57,000 That is, you find half a dozen or a dozen people that you start interacting with in the MOOC, and forget the other 450. 165 00:19:57,000 --> 00:19:59,000 Did you find it worked that way? [19.59] 166 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:07,000 [Fabrizio] I got lost at -- right from the beginning. 167 00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:17,000 And it took me a while to see how it worked and all of this, the mail, the chat, the Diigo group and -- 168 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:26,000 It's quite complicated in a way, very difficult to get in touch with all of the participants. (20:26) 169 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:31,000 we've got a huge amount of posts and if you don't have enough time, 170 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:38,000 it's quite difficult to keep in touch with everything. 171 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,000 [Lucia] Well...[metallic-like noise]. 172 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,000 Sorry: that was an ambulance going by. 173 00:20:50,000 --> 00:21:02,000 Ok, yes. Well, we're adults, so we all have families and we have jobs 174 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:05,000 and it was the end of the school year. 175 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:10,000 So, it is really remarkable that we spent so many hours doing the cMooc. 176 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:14,000 Really professor Formiconi had us hooked. [21.15] 177 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:20,000 [Vance] He sounds like a great teacher. 178 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:23,000 I'm just reading again, to the bottom of your list 179 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:30,000 of what the cMooc, "A few figures" -- and I noticed that 180 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,000 some people did it for a university credit. 181 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:40,000 That's one of -- that's an issue in Moocs is -- it's supposed to be a Massive Open Online Course 182 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:45,000 but it's perfectly fine if you want to run one that will accredit people. 183 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:48,000 That's actually one of the problems, that Moocs don't provide credit 184 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,000 so people are looking into badge systems and 185 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,000 of course, if you can run it through a university 186 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:56,000 and get university credits that's fine. 187 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:00,000 But the question is, are the materials open, that is, 188 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:05,000 can anybody... I suppose so, you must have had 430 people 189 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:11,000 who were able to go freely onto the Internet and find the materials. 190 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,000 [22.11] So are those materials still up there 191 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,000 in which case they will be open and anybody can go and look at them 192 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:20,000 and learn from them? Is that the way the course works? 193 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:29,000 [Lucia] Well, there weren't any separate materials. 194 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:33,000 There were the posts that professor Formiconi published 195 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:43,000 and he gave us his instructions there and he commented on what we were doing and how we were doing it. 196 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:49,000 [22.43 ] We worked through comments maybe, as you can see from the numbers there 197 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:54,000 and the material was made by us, the pupils. 198 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:58,000 I mean, we were instructed to create.. 199 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,000 He used this metaphor of the village 200 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:04,000 He said: Ok, we are going to build the village all together. 201 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:12,000 In the village we're going to build houses, and the houses will be blogs that we're going to create 202 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:20,000 Then we're going to build roads, and this will be via a web feed aggregator. 203 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:32,000 And so we learned to import an OPML file and to aggregate the news from the blogs 204 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,000 [23.32] to link the blogs together and so we had a network 205 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:43,000 and we didn't need any other material, in that everybody started writing on their blogs 206 00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:48,000 and we kept going around and visiting and reading and commenting 207 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:57,000 and then professor Formiconi introduced the next thing, or the next task which was to use tags 208 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:04,000 and he presented us with the idea of classifying the information 209 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:08,000 and wrote a long philosophical work about classifying and how you classify, 210 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:15,000 what folksonomia is and so on, so we started classifying quite freely. [24.13] 211 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:20,000 Then something kept on emerging - kept on emerging. 212 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:33,000 And so it was creative. It was chaotic on the one side but very clearly structured at the same time on the other side. 213 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:39,000 So, I hope I've been clear about how the thing went on.[24.39] 214 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:49,000 [Fabrizio] I agree with Lucia and I just wanted to say thanks again--- 215 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:56,000 It was a bit shocking at the beginning, the difference between this Mooc and the others. 216 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:03,000 I didn't even dare to ask where are the assignments and where is the syllabus, 217 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:16,000 because there wasn't a blog or a Moodle block where you have all the assignments divided in weeks and all the rest, 218 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:23,000 the usual way you find in an online course or in a Mooc. 219 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:35,000 It looked, it seemed very improvised. I'm sure it wasn't, but that was the way they chose. 220 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:44,000 [25.34] Having things to ...- how can I say - to grow along. 221 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:56,000 We had to find our way through the course, we had to pick up that pulse with the right assignments 222 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,000 and try to do it by yourself 223 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:07,000 There wasn't even...as far as I know,a proper evaluation or assessment 224 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,000 no fixed days, 225 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:15,000 you know, first week you do this, second week you do that and then you get graded 226 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:25,000 and things are going on, now, we keep doing that, that's a great thing, it never stops. 227 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:36,000 [Vance] Yes, actually, Lucia's question was she making things clear: yes, 228 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:43,000 and the course as I understand is over, We are coming into summer now, so... 229 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:50,000 But you're continuing to meet in your community, your community continues, that's really interesting. 230 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:56,000 I have a question about the OPML aggregation: 231 00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:05,000 how would you access each other's blogs? Is there a link where the aggregation occurred, 232 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:09,000 so that you could go to one place and see the posts? 233 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:14,000 How would you see the aggregation of everybody's blogs? How did you see that? 234 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:29,000 [Claude] Can I try? The OPML file gathers all the RSS feeds of our blogs, 235 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:38,000 so when you add that OPML file to an aggregator, for example Bloglines or RSSowl 236 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,000 then you could see everything that's happening in the blogs, 237 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:48,000 because there's a feed for the posts, and a feed for the comments for each blog. 238 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,000 So it's a very long file, but it works. Is that clear? 239 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,000 [Vance] Yes, that's clear. 240 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:13,000 So, I'm going to really miss Google Reader. They're threatening to get rid of it, but that's what I would, erh -- 241 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:21,000 because with Google Reader you can... I suppose you can use an OPML file, within Bloglines, yes, OK. 242 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:33,000 So... Yes, I can see how you can use an RSS reader to read an OPML file into your... into a reader. 243 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:38,000 So, that's very good, that's... getting the basics. 244 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:50,000 And then -- yes, ok, anything that aggregates content, anything that will take an RSS feed, I think you can put it there. 245 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:55,000 So that's really good, that you got the building block, and then you learned how to build on that. 246 00:28:55,000 --> 00:29:05,000 And I also liked, as you said, I like the analogy of building the cities and then the streets connecting them 247 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,000 I think that's ... that's really interesting. 248 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,000 It sounds very much like what George Siemens would set up 249 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,000 and one thing that fascinates me about Moocs is, 250 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:23,000 of course the big problem is, Where is the centre? Where do you go, that's what Fabrizio has been expressing, 251 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:29,000 confusion at first. How do you orient in a Mooc? 252 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,000 You have to find the streets, you have to find the the ways... the highways that people are using 253 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:42,000 and of course you can't find it all, which, that's the way the world is, you don't ever learn everything. 254 00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:53,000 [29.46] So, anyway, if you can speak of any techniques that helped you to find the things that other people were doing 255 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:56,000 the OPML file would be one, you could see their blog posts 256 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,000 I note that you must have shared bookmarks. 257 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:05,000 You said 990 tags produced: so, can you tell me about that? 258 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,000 What were -- you were tagging all over the place, obviously 259 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:14,000 but when you say "tags were produced", how did you find the 990 tags, let's say? 260 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:28,000 [Fabrizio] As I was trying to explain in the chat, I've also tried to - I've been trying since when things started 261 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,000 to put things together, to put the blogs together, for example, [30:32] 262 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:39,000 All the blogs were too many, actually. At present one of the problems is, there's more than 200. 263 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,000 With then all the usual tools 264 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:49,000 we used to bookmark, and-or visual book -- have visual bookmarking of the resources 265 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:57,000 So, there's a padlet board that is available inside the Google Drive and in the wikispace, 266 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:02,000 and I've also tried to do something on Pinterest 267 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:13,000 And we've got a Diigo group for the MOOC that's working very very well 268 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:21,000 And I'm also trying to have a map with the new Google map engine 269 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:30,000 using the spreadsheet the teacher kindly shared through the Google Drive 270 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:35,000 and it is interesting, you can have all the blogs on a map 271 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:46,000 and being based on a spreadsheet, you can work on it, now, have them on different layers according to the tags, 272 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:58,000 that is, the main tags, the secondary-- and later we... I think we can have them on different layers, so 273 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:07,000 as regards the kind of school, primary schools, the secondary schools or the language: 274 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:14,000 something interesting to work on for the future. For me, at least. I'm studying that. 275 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:31,000 [32.22 Lucia] It is very interesting to see what professor Formiconi did to promote interaction between us. 276 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:38,000 Sometimes he would encourage us to meet in order to do some very practical things 277 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:47,000 For example there was a moment when he was introducing some very very basic XML code 278 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:59,000 and so he opened a pad in piratepad.net and he had us go and watch there and experiment 279 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:05,000 on the shared pad: so an experiment with some shared writing. 280 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:13,000 At moments, some other moments he would just stop and step back and watch and wait 281 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:19,000 and he used silence in a very active way. I know it sounds strange 282 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:29,000 but he would use silence and waiting as an active tool in order to give us time to know each other. 283 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:35,000 So... It was great fun! I was very tired in the evening, 284 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:42,000 I would do the washing up and then I would sit in front of my computer and then dive into Bloglines, 285 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:51,000 literally dive among the blogs and read it here and there and contact people and read a comment here and there, 286 00:33:51,000 --> 00:34:01,000 and very soon I found the people who were most similar to me in a way or who had similar interests 287 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:08,000 and it was clear that we were interacting more often than with other people. 288 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:13,000 I'm quite aware that I don't know most of the people who were there 289 00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:21,000 and I mean to go on exploring, because I think that there's riches there in the course. 290 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,000 The course will go on living for a long time for me, I think. 291 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:31,000 [34.29 Vance] Look, that's very interesting. 292 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,000 Steven Downes, I'm sure you're familiar with him, 293 00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:45,000 says that the teacher's role is to model and demonstrate and the students' role is to practice and reflect. 294 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:54,000 And Dave Warlick says that teachers are really master learners, and to me that means 295 00:34:54,000 --> 00:35:00,000 that teachers are both teachers and learners at the same time, 296 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:05,000 that is, they're always modelling, demonstrating, practising and reflecting. 297 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:14,000 So it works like you make coffee, you know: you percolate these four things, and do that all the time. 298 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:23,000 So this is obviously a teacher who models and demonstrates and then you practise and reflect 299 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:29,000 and with your students it's your turn to model and demonstrate. 300 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:36,000 And I'm wondering, have you applied these techniques in courses that you yourselves have created? Have you-- 301 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:42,000 How have you applied the techniques you learned from your professor in your work 302 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:47,000 and... Not yet, says Lucia. Ok. Or maybe, how would you anticipate doing that, 303 00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:53,000 how would you structure courses, so that you can use some of these things that have been modelled to you 304 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:59,000 and as you say, you're reflecting now and you're thinking - how can I .. 305 00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:06,000 I'm learning so much from this, how can I do it, how can I... so, I don't go into my first classroom 306 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,000 and tell the students: "Open your textbooks", you know? 307 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:14,000 How would you make that leak now into your own work, your own courses that you teach? 308 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,000 [Lucia] Well, this is a very hard question, Vance, because... 309 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:35,000 For example, I teach in a high school, and in this high school we have a lot of limitations I would say. 310 00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:43,000 I don't feel free to create and explore. If you like.... you have to do things, in a way. 311 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:55,000 So I feel the most important lesson I'm taking from this MOOC is, you really need to hook your students, 312 00:36:55,000 --> 00:37:01,000 you need to create something that hooks them, so that they will be willing to explore. 313 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:11,000 Actually with what we - with what I do every day, I try to be creative, but I'm not very successful, in fact, 314 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:21,000 and so my students, who are supposed to be digital natives and are not... 315 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:26,000 resist me, they push back. So, this is going to be a great challenge. 316 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:34,000 [37.30 Vance] Maybe Rita.. She's still here, she's commenting on the chat, 317 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,000 maybe you can talk a little bit about how you motivate your students 318 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:44,000 because we've been participating in a community of practice called Webheads for a long time, 319 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:53,000 and some of the things that we do to help each other to learn, we apply to our own students. 320 00:37:54,000 --> 00:38:00,000 I guess I'm thinking of writing matrix (?[metrics?]) just off the top of my head but I'm sure there are other things as well. 321 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:05,000 Maybe Rita you would like to address how you use the things that you've learned 322 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:08,000 from interacting with other teachers, in your own courses. 323 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:13,000 [38.10 Rita] Yes Vance thank you very much for giving me the floor. 324 00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:21,000 Yes, you know, we started working together on this integration of technology many many years ago, 325 00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:35,000 and in fact when I started, that was about 2002 or 03, nobody here was really into technology, 326 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:40,000 so I must have looked to people as a kind of a freak. 327 00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:48,000 But anyhow I tried to understand that, well, my students were new to this as well 328 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:57,000 and the crucial thing was motivating them, to make them feel this question, I mean 329 00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:04,000 the thing that they had been learning English for so many years and using it in a very limited context 330 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:10,000 the environment in which we teach our students is very constrained, I mean 331 00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:14,000 we just do everything within the four walls of the classroom 332 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:21,000 and in Argentina, same as in Italy, both... maybe in Italy it's a little bit different, 333 00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:27,000 but we don't have too many people ready on the streets to speak naturally with students in English 334 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:33,000 so students are not used to practising their English in an everyday context. 335 00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:39,000 So I tried to make them realize the importance of their being learning English for so many years 336 00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:48,000 and I also tried to see what it was that motivated them to use English in natural contexts [39.48] 337 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:57,000 such as, for example, the possibility of getting together with other students from other countries 338 00:39:57,000 --> 00:40:02,000 with whom they would be able to interact, to pass on information, share experience 339 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:14,000 even see in fact, what life was, in other places, in other countries, and share in what they were interested in 340 00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:21,000 so I tried to see what it was that each group would be motivated by 341 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:31,000 and by.. by saying this, I'm really implying that the most important thing in teaching with technology 342 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:34,000 is motivating our students, 343 00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:41,000 because we can see that on a computer they learn [check] how to really work with a programme, with a new tool 344 00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:46,000 but the most challenging thing for us teachers is motivation, 345 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:50,000 how to see what students would be interested in, 346 00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:59,000 what appeals to students, to come up with a tool and with a new task that they will enjoy working on. 347 00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,000 In fact that's it, really. 348 00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:09,000 [Vance] And I think it's so important, as our Italian colleagues pointed out, 349 00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:16,000 that you let the students build their own highways, you know, put [up] their own content. 350 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:23,000 I really like that kind of concept, where the teacher doesn't build the course 351 00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:30,000 the teacher sort of makes a Petri dish, and then the students populate it, you know, 352 00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:39,000 and you find out their interests that way. So obviously, they've been motivated. That's really interesting. [41.39] 353 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:47,000 Ok, we have about 10 minutes, or even 13 or 20 minutes 354 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:53,000 it's really up to you, we don't have any... nobody closes us down at any time. 355 00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:57,000 [Referring to the shared screen] So, well, I've put a web page up in the share... 356 00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:03,000 I think in one of my versions of it, there is -- that from English, 357 00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,000 but I don't know, maybe you can tell a bit about this page, 358 00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:12,000 this must be the page that... organized the MOOC, that announced the MOOC 359 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:17,000 so you can comment on it for those of us who aren't so good with Italian. 360 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:29,000 [42.25] So, I'll really st-- oh I'm sorry, I'm having trouble releasing the mike, let me try that. 361 00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:37,000 [Vance] Oh, not sure what's going on here, let me just -- [clattering noise] 362 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:41,000 I'm so sorry I'm not able to release the mike. 363 00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:47,000 It's not responding ...] Oh, oh, I see, I've got an error message on my computer also, 364 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:51,000 I might have to go back, I might have to come back in as a session moderator, 365 00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:56,000 I might click "close programme", I'm not sure what'll happen, but anyway, I'll do that. 366 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,000 Yeah, I think I've solved the problem. 367 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:11,000 So, the page I've just put up: this is an announcement of the MOOC, in case there's anything to comment there, 368 00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:17,000 you can, if not, we can pass on to some other things we can show you. 369 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:23,000 Are you ready for any other questions that anybody else has... 370 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:25,000 Would you like to ask questions of each other? 371 00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:33,000 [43.27 Lucia, referring to the shared screen] What you can see is the teacher's blog. 372 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:39,000 So, this is where he wrote his tasks and comments and philosophy and everything. 373 00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:49,000 We also had video tutorials, he published 23 video tutorials here. 374 00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:58,000 [43.52 Vance] Ah, ok, yes, I was confusing Lucia with Rita, I wasn't sure who was that. 375 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:04,000 OK: I'm going to pull out something that one of our teachers is doing. 376 00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:12,000 We have a teacher in Amazonia, who has been using some of these techniques with her own students. 377 00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:19,000 And recently in Brazil they've been having protests, and so she organized her students to... 378 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:25,000 She's already connected with Webheads on a few of her students' projects, 379 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:28,000 Webheads had been commenting on her students' blogs, 380 00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:37,000 but the one they did just recently, she said it was the best thing she had ever done in her career, 381 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,000 and that was getting the students to put online... 382 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:44,000 Because they've found an audience, you know, so they are motivated to connect with the audience. 383 00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:50,000 The audience in Webheads is responding to them, you know, commenting on their blogs, 384 00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,000 and with Cintia's encouragement 385 00:44:53,000 --> 00:45:01,000 And so I'll find that URL and put it there, and show you some stuff from somebody in our community 386 00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:06,000 who is motivating her students using these techniques, give me a moment here. 387 00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:09,000 Please continue. [pause] 388 00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:19,000 Ok, keep in mind we're recording, we're hoping to have the conversation continue. 389 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:23,000 Oh, I should say, by the way, that this is an event of... 390 00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:29,000 Ah, well yes, ok, that's a good one. Let me... I'll share that. 391 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:37,000 That's not the one I was looking for, but this is actually a MOOC that we participate in, 392 00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:42,000 "Goodbye Gutenberg", this is something that started.out as a multiliteraces course 393 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:49,000 and, ah, I'm just trying to type its URL in here. 394 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:59,000 OK: yeah, this is... we've turned this into a MOOC concept. It was... What this is, it's a... 395 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:06,000 Let's...somebody just switched this back to... Yep, ok, 396 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:11,000 Ok, maybe I can grab this ... 397 00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:19,000 We're having more technical difficulties here. We have ... one of the moderators... 398 00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:26,000 switched us back to the - to us off the 'web share' 399 00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:34,000 So now I'm trying to get the URL back in there. Ok, so this is the Goodbye Gutenberg blog here. 400 00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:40,000 Ok, so, there used to be a way to put this into the text chat. 401 00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:42,000 Oh, you've put it in there already. [46.42] 402 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:52,000 So that's -- what that tries to do is to try to get participants to make -- to keep ePortfolios. 403 00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:56,000 Is that a concept that you would think that your teacher had? 404 00:46:56,000 --> 00:47:01,000 You know, it could be, what you're doing is making ePortfolios, that is, commenting on your own learning: 405 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,000 that is, in a way, an ePortfolio. 406 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:09,000 An ePortfolio can be just about anything, depending on how you like to interpret it. 407 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:19,000 But in this particular Web page here, you'll find the links to Dave Cormier's videos. 408 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,000 - maybe I can find those for you - 409 00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:27,000 there is a -- and also a reference to George Siemens's interview with Howard Rheingold. 410 00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:30,000 I think that will be here, on this page. 411 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,000 I just clicked on "Getting started." 412 00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:40,000 And there, you find a link to Siemens' conversation with Howard Rheingold 413 00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:44,000 and also Dave Cormier's videos. 414 00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:48,000 So there are some links that you can follow there. 415 00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:55,000 OK, I'm gonna go back to searching for the page I was looking for. 416 00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:06,000 OK: I've found it. There's going to be a little dead space in the recording there, but that's OK. 417 00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:10,000 OK, so this is one of the teachers who interacts with us 418 00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:15,000 -- oh, it looks like it's in Portuguese, but of course, you can translate that. 419 00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:16,000 But in any event, her students have posted some videos. 420 00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:29,000 I suppose "Our generation does care," that's the one that she had her students do. 421 00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:33,000 That's it, yeah, so that link will come up - should come up in a minute. 422 00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:38,000 I'm not sure if I -- it doesn't seem to be hyperlinking, but anyway, 423 00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:42,000 maybe you can search for "Our generation does care" on YouTube. 424 00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:52,000 OK, so, any further comments, coming up to the top of the hour? 425 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:58,000 Claire is saying you can click on the YouTube text and then it will work. 426 00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:01,000 Oh yes, I see that's true, it does. OK, yes, gotcha. 427 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:14,000 Yes, it just an example: this is a teacher who's been interacting with us and -- well, with her students -- 428 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:18,000 Oh, it came on in sound, I'm hearing it now. 429 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:21,000 Now I'll have to turn that off, somehow. 430 00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:23,000 Are you hearing sound as well? 431 00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:36,000 I'm getting inundated with audio, that I'm not -- unable to turn off, I'm not sure how it came on. 432 00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:38,000 Oh, here it is. 433 00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,000 Ah, I found it. 434 00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:46,000 [some audio in background] 435 00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:51,000 [Vance] Hem [laughs]. Oh well. Yeah, I found it, OK, there we go. 436 00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:59,000 OK, it launched in a window and it was blaring in my ear, 437 00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:04,000 and I was unable to find the window that launched to switch it off. 438 00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:18,000 OK. So, what we do when the mic -- when people stop interacting, you're so welcome, 439 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:23,000 Lucia is saying thank you. Please you can please say thank you or say goodbye, 440 00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:29,000 say your last remarks in the recording, so we can have that to end our recording with. 441 00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,000 And this will all go into learning2gether.net, 442 00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,000 and that's where we archive everything, 443 00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:41,000 and we'll make an Elluminate recording, which you can have almost right away, 444 00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:44,000 as soon as everybody leaves the room, that Elluminate recording gets made. 445 00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:51,000 I'll post the link on Twitter, I'll post it to the #ltis13 hashtag, so you can find it there 446 00:50:52,000 --> 00:51:02,000 and so please, if you want to say goodbye, you can do that now, and thank you very much for coming. 447 00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:05,000 It's been really a nice session, I really enjoyed this. 448 00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:12,000 [Lucia] OK, thank you, Vance, it was nice being here, 449 00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:17,000 and it was very useful having to prepare everything for this event, 450 00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:26,000 because it helped me clarify ideas and it added some value to what I was doing, to what I did. 451 00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:30,000 So -- and it will be a pleasure to be able to go to your blog, 452 00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:37,000 and then be able to listen again and think again about what everybody said. 453 00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:39,000 So, thank you very much. 454 00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:46,000 [Vance] OK, well, ciao to all our friends in Italy, 455 00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:53,000 and thank you for coming, and I've just put the learning2gether.net website up, where-- 456 00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:57,000 you'll be able to go there and see the blog post of this event, 457 00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:04,000 which will have the link to the Elluminate recording and also, will have an MP file that you can download. 458 00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:09,000 So, as soon as everything goes quiet, I'll stop the recording 459 00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:15,000 and when everybody leaves the room, then that recording will get put online 460 00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:17,000 and I'll start processing it from there. 461 00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:24,000 So thanks again: I really appreciate your -- and nice to meet you all, and ciao - bye bye.